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FBI Child ID App

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Re: FBI Child ID App

#221

Post by lwswl »

Tade0 wrote: post #106
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

Fingerprints aren't even particularly useful here. Our irises are considerably more information-dense, accessible and stable over time as evidenced by the famous identification of Sharbat Gula: https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~jgd1000/afghan.html A close-up photo should be enough to reliably identify a person years after they went missing.

But your irises don't tend to leave traces everywhere, and are thus only valuable for telling who you are, not where you've been.

Although that depends on the number of cameras around, access to them, and how much they are recording. Fingerprints are a lot simpler and easier to access.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#222

Post by lwswl »

SapporoChris wrote: post #149
Tade0 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fingerprints aren't even particularly useful here. Our irises are considerably more information-dense, accessible and stable over time as evidenced by the famous identification of Sharbat Gula: https://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~jgd1000/afghan.html A close-up photo should be enough to reliably identify a person years after they went missing.

While most people do have stable iris patterns it is not the case for everyone. Numerous conditions can cause changes in the eyes. Glaucoma being the most obvious one, but there are a whole host of other conditions like lisch nodules, Uveal melanoma, etc. However, perhaps with training, identification could be made in spite of changes to the iris.

Interesting

Re: FBI Child ID App

#224

Post by autoexec »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #189
AndyMcConachie wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Happened to me as well. Now the FBI has my fingerprints on file even though I've never committed a crime. I had a discussion with my Mom a couple years about this and she admitted she screwed up. I can't blame her of course. Especially since at the time there was plenty of FBI propoganda about missing kids terrifying parents and claiming this was a solution.

> I can't blame her of course. Especially since at the time there was plenty of FBI propoganda about missing kids terrifying parents and claiming this was a solution. So long as we keep giving people a pass for falling for this crap they have no incentive not to fall for this crap.

Let's keep the blame on the government which is meant to serve us, not the people who were only doing what they thought was best after having been deceived by that same government.

Holding your mom accountable for a mistake she made when you were a baby isn't helping anyone, holding your government accountable for building a database of our DNA/fingerprints against our wishes helps everyone.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#225

Post by dredmorbius »

libraryatnight wrote: post #161
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

I remember this! I got finger printed at some event where police had a booth next to the fire dept (who were espousing bike helmets and teaching kids how to properly wear one etc, actually useful safety info). It wasn't until I was a teenager when my first car was broken into and the speakers stolen that I realized how useless that endeavor must be. The officer who responded (my first time calling the police, not run…

There's a science-fiction short story I've been trying to remember for quite some time.

I'd all but certainly read it in an anthology during the 1970s or early 1980s, probably one of the award compilations (Hugos, Analog, etc.).

A computer programmer and his boss are working on a large data tracking system that is about to be activated, in which everyone's identification and personal information are entered. The boss gives the programmer the choice of opting out of the system. The programmer opts out.

For the life of me I cannot remember the rest of the story, the author, year, etc. But it's stuck with me, and comes to mind often as a slew of ever-more-invasive online information systems (ISP email, some early LinkedIn-type start-ups, MySpace and Facebook, Google Gmail, Google+, etc.) have come on to the scene.

If anyone can remember what story this was, or others reasonably similar to it, I'd be grateful.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#226

Post by dredmorbius »

gonzo41 wrote: post #135
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

I got bonded (Police background checks with fingerprinting etc) for a job which had a large cash handling component. dealing with > 100K in twenties and fifties in a Casino. My prints were kept for elimination after the process, but the police were very eager to inform me that they don't get kept past two years. The police had petitioned the government under the guise of privacy laws to make sure they had to throw aw…

For those of us with an inverted threat model, the profit motive here seems an interesting approach.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#227

Post by xg15 »

libraryatnight wrote: post #161
alsetmusic wrote: post #62

There's a television ad that stands out in my memory from when I was a kid (80s). The camera pans across patrons at a diner and the voiceover is about how a kidnapped child was recovered as the camera stops on a young girl (~8yo). The child is described, but the child the camera landed on has different features (hair dyed, cut, whatever). The explanation for how she was identified is that her fingerprints were on fil…

I remember this! I got finger printed at some event where police had a booth next to the fire dept (who were espousing bike helmets and teaching kids how to properly wear one etc, actually useful safety info). It wasn't until I was a teenager when my first car was broken into and the speakers stolen that I realized how useless that endeavor must be. The officer who responded (my first time calling the police, not run…

> "You'll never get your speakers back, even if we found them we wouldn't call you, they'd probably be in a lot of all kinds of other stolen stuff and it's impossible to sort through and return stolen items."

Wait what? So police simply keeps stolen goods with no option for the original owners to get them back? Because civil asset forfeiture isn't enough I guess?

Re: FBI Child ID App

#228

Post by throwaway0a5e »

autoexec wrote: post #224
throwaway0a5e wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can't blame her of course. Especially since at the time there was plenty of FBI propoganda about missing kids terrifying parents and claiming this was a solution. So long as we keep giving people a pass for falling for this crap they have no incentive not to fall for this crap.

Let's keep the blame on the government which is meant to serve us, not the people who were only doing what they thought was best after having been deceived by that same government. Holding your mom accountable for a mistake she made when you were a baby isn't helping anyone, holding your government accountable for building a database of our DNA/fingerprints against our wishes helps everyone.

>Let's keep the blame on the government which is meant to serve us, not the people who were only doing what they thought was best after having been deceived by that same government.

At some point the people enable the government. People need to feel stupid for falling for that crap or they will keep falling for it.

>Holding your mom accountable for a mistake she made when you were a baby isn't helping anyone, holding your government accountable for building a database of our DNA/fingerprints against our wishes helps everyone.

This is not how it works.

If people cannot find the will to hold the people in their lives accountable then they will never find the will to hold the government accountable.

I'm not saying the dude has to pistol whip his mom and set the house on fire over it but it'd be nice if people would resent those kinds of decisions made by their parents and other people in their lives (like the aunt who submits her DNA to one of those ancestry services that shares it) a little more.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#229

Post by yellowapple »

> An important note: The FBI is not collecting or storing any photos or information that you enter in the app. All data resides solely on your mobile device unless you need to send it to authorities.

I'd believe that about as far as I can throw it.

Re: FBI Child ID App

#230

Post by MacsHeadroom »

xg15 wrote: post #227
libraryatnight wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember this! I got finger printed at some event where police had a booth next to the fire dept (who were espousing bike helmets and teaching kids how to properly wear one etc, actually useful safety info). It wasn't until I was a teenager when my first car was broken into and the speakers stolen that I realized how useless that endeavor must be. The officer who responded (my first time calling the police, not run…

> "You'll never get your speakers back, even if we found them we wouldn't call you, they'd probably be in a lot of all kinds of other stolen stuff and it's impossible to sort through and return stolen items." Wait what? So police simply keeps stolen goods with no option for the original owners to get them back? Because civil asset forfeiture isn't enough I guess?

The police don't keep stollen goods, don't be silly.

They auction them off and use the profits to buy tanks and grenade launchers.

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