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How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

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Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#221

Post by TheOtherHobbes »

iNerdier wrote: post #179
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But Indont think this is about "some guy came up with a crap design". It strikes me a number of things went badly 1. I think C-level execs at major corporations should have built up immunity against such bullshit. 2. The heatmap (plus the associated idea of lots of consumer testing) should have spotted something 3. the rollout seems to have been global and immediate, instead of for example testing the new packaging o…

C-level execs are the bullshit in these stories. They meddled with something that wasn’t broken and this was the result.

Logo Management is practically a cliche. Can't think what else to do to justify the big bucks? New Logo™!

So articles like these completely miss the point of the commercial design industry.

The goal isn't sales - never mind brand awareness. The goal is to make C-suite execs feel like they're doing something exciting, and maybe even a little creative.

From that POV I'm sure the Tropicana rebrand was a huge success.

And if a design fails, it's always the agency's fault.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#222

Post by micromacrofoot »

ineedasername wrote: post #199
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

I would be suspicious of any orange juice where the company feels the need to stipulate "real orange juice". What the heck else would it be made of? Reminds me of "ice cream" which, in a lot of cases, is not. Mixed in the ice cream section next to identical looking cartons of different flavors Breuer's is a big culprit) are things that say "whipped dairy dessert" in the place that others say "ice cream".

Tang, Sunny D, and Kool-aid basically ruined the entire juice industry by popularizing adding artificial flavor and coloring to sugar water. IMO they shouldn't even be allowed to show images of fruit in their packaging/marketing, shouldn't be able to market to kids, and they should have a surgeon general's warning about obesity akin to cigarette packaging and cancer.

I've accidentally bought what I thought was fruit juice more than one time, and learned my lesson about reading the label. Many people might not ever bother.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#223

Post by gwbas1c »

The article totally misses the point of why the rebrand failed.

I used to drink Tropicana Grovestand all the time in the 2000s. One day, I showed up at the grocery store, and a bunch of people were in front of the Tropicana rack, looking confused.

I tried to find "Grovestand," but I couldn't. There were tons of identical bottles to choose from. Eventually, after staring at the bottles for a few minutes, I saw tiny text at the top of the bottle, hidden under the angle from the shelf above. It said things like, "no pulp," "pulpy," "lots of pulp."

I had no idea which one was "Grovestand."

Now, when it comes to orange juice, I really only like "Grovestand," so I took the time to shake the bottles around and figure out that "pulpy" was "Grovestand" and that "with pulp" wasn't. But, if there was another brand that I liked, you bet I would have bought it instead.

All they needed to do was keep the old brand names, and make the words visible. That's it. Even though I was relieved when they went back to the old packaging, I was disappointed. All I wanted them to do was make it easy to find "Grovestand."

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#224

Post by was_a_dev »

bin_bash wrote: post #201
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

Juice in general just seems terribly unhealthy in 2022. I enjoy it as a treat now and again but think of it more like a dessert rather than a part of my daily breakfast routine.

Non-ironically, the only time I drink Tropicana, or any fruit juice anymore is when I buy it at McDonald's

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#226

Post by scythe »

treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

On the plus side, increasing awareness of the problem has made it more common to see actual fresh orange juice squeezed onsite at stores. And it's delicious.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#227

Post by johnday »

nkurz wrote: post #213
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

> I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Don't be silly --- it means you are buying juice from oranges that has been stripped of all flavor, stored in tankers for a year or two, and then reconstituted by adding "flavor packs" built by recombining the chemicals found in different oranges. Pretending this isn't clear to consumers is just anti-progress. Along…

I'm not sure if you're being sarcastic, but I really don't think this is "clear to consumers".

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#228

Post by subpixel »

bin_bash wrote: post #201
treyfitty wrote: post #197

Carton design, or not, I don't buy orange juice anymore because I don't know what "Made from Real Oranges*" means anymore. Over time, I came to learn that straightforward claims like these are engineered to deceive. Tropicana could use 100% real oranges, and I still wouldn't believe them. I could inspect the ingredients, and even then, it's dubious- companies have found ways to circumvent the rules there too. Instead…

Juice in general just seems terribly unhealthy in 2022. I enjoy it as a treat now and again but think of it more like a dessert rather than a part of my daily breakfast routine.

It's just one of those weird things that people, especially Americans, have been conditioned to think is wholesome.

After some time not drinking it, orange juice is almost sickeningly sweet to me.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#229

Post by jmartrican »

I suspect that redesigns (e.g. packaging, UIs) should happen in a lean agile way. And over time, the new design would replace the old. I just think that redesigns are too risky to do all in one release. Redesigns can cause too much cognitive overload and dismisses the emotional connection with the old design that customers have built up over time.

I think redesigns should still happen, but maybe is smaller steps. Where these small steps can be easily A/B tested or rolled back.

Re: How did Tropicana lose $30M in a packaging redesign?

#230

Post by lmkg »

mark-r wrote: post #118
filmgirlcw wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, as risky and brand and logo redesigns are, there is often a need to want to modernize or revitalize your logo or mark or packaging. It’s more difficult, the larger/older/more iconic your packaging is. That’s why the best logo and branding and packaging redesigns tend to either be the most iterative or have changed early in a product/brand’s lifecycle before he could be too associated with a company. The Tropi…

One of my favorite graphics is this one detailing the evolution of the Pepsi logo vs. the Coca-Cola logo: https://flowingdata.com/2009/08/13/pepsi-and-coca-cola-logo-... Of course it was over-dramatized for effect, and the truth emerges further down the page. But it's close enough to true that it stops and makes you think.

One of those brands has endured for over 125 years, is today worth over $18 billion dollars, and is the 36th-most valuable company in the world.

The other is Coca-Cola.

Pepsi gets an absolutely undeserved amount of shit[1]. It's one of the most successful companies in the world. It's impressive on every single metric other than "is Coca-Cola." The fact that they can have that level of success while competing head-to-head with one of the most successful brands of all-time ought to be reason for accolades, not insults.

The takeaway that I choose to get from that graphic is that there are multiple paths to success, and one need not imitate the market-leader's strategy.

[1] Except that one logo document. It absolutely deserved all the shit it got for that one.

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