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Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

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Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#221

Post by philistine »

finite_jest wrote: post #106
mulmen wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Young and Mitchell pulling their music is literally freedom of speech (free expression). Neil Young can do whatever he wants with his content (speech), just like Rogan. This is competition in the free marketplace of ideas. You're absolutely entitled to your opinion on these actions and you're free to support Spotify or Young or Mitchell or any combination of the three. But there is no "freedom of speech" side here.

> But there is no "freedom of speech" side here. There is. Rogan is not trying to remove Neil Young's music from anywhere. I've heard this unfruitful line of argument too often recently. Besides being unfruitful, I think it is based on a subtle fallacy/diversion. The idea of free expression reasonably includes the right to criticize the principle itself. For example, in the US, you absolutely have the legal right to…

Imagine a TV network hosting a show called neo-nazis throwing eggs at Jews at 8pm, and then you at 9pm for an important discussion on your favourite subject.

You’d have every right to rethink your association with that platform, and demand they not air the neo-nazis if they want to have you on.

This is not about free speech. It’s about freedom of association. You can’t force Neil Young to be associated with Joe Rogan if he doesn’t want to, and you can’t argue he doesn’t have a right to tell Spotify they can’t have both of them.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#222

Post by tomcat27 »

woodruffw wrote: post #161
tomcat27 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK boycott is temporary but de-platforming is permanent. -- closing a contract.

I don't think closing a contract is a permanent thing. You can always reopen it or start a new one if and when the complaints have been addressed. That seems to be what most people have in mind, at least in my experience.

On closing a contract a new one is needed, unlike boycott.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#223

Post by zapataband1 »

newfriend wrote: post #128
zapataband1 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isnt a free speech issue. Neil Young is not the government nor is spotify. If Neil Young didn't want to be on the same tv show as joe rogan nobody would care. This amounts to the exact same thing.

So freedom of speech only exists if government is involved? I don't think that's correct. These artists are attempting to use pressure to silence someone else. That's 100% a "free speech" issue.

No post body was provided.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#224

Post by zapataband1 »

dazilcher wrote: post #202
zapataband1 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry Neil Young isn't the all powerful boogeyman that you think he is. He isn't censoring joe rogan because he doesn't have that power.

> Neil Young [...] joe rogan Interesting capitalization choice. Intentional?

No post body was provided.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#225

Post by alar44 »

Zigurd wrote: post #215
alar44 wrote: post #54

"If you give me six lines written by the hand of the most honest of men, I will find something in them which will hang him." Joni and Neil can do whatever they want and I respect that. What bothers me are all of the virtue signalers following them and getting rid of Spotify (or claiming to). You will not be able to consume anything if you actually care about these standards. Everyone is shitty and people are wrong al…

Quoted post unavailable.

I think Joe Rogan is awful as well. I'm not going to try to silence him though or an entire platform. I just don't listen to his material.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#228

Post by Blackstrat »

kennywinker wrote: post #203
Blackstrat wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps but there is no parallel between the polio and the COVID vaccine. The former reduced the incidence of polio by more than 99% while the latter, well it does not.

No parallel because one is a bit less effective than the other? That’s a weird take

A bit? That’s an understatement of epic proportions

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#229

Post by kennywinker »

Blackstrat wrote: post #228
kennywinker wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No parallel because one is a bit less effective than the other? That’s a weird take

A bit? That’s an understatement of epic proportions

And exactly how big does the gap need to be before they stop being comparable? We can compare 99% effective vaccines and 98% effective vaccines, surely? so a 1% spread is ok... but a 10% spread and now we're in "no parallel" territory?

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#230

Post by CRConrad »

ch4s3 wrote: post #145
sorry_outta_gas wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TBH I can't blame people for being weary of GMO in general after the decades of pumping people full or garbage hormones and whatever else it's a trust issue not a "science" one

GMO crops are exactly not "garbage hormones", and people consume them all of the time without complaint. I don't see anyone picketing the yogurt cases in their local super markets. Lot's of hormones survive intact through digestion and can enter the blood stream, but your body doesn't absorb the genetic material of food[1]. DNA is fragile and it's really hard to get foreign DNA into a cell, much less the nucleus. Our…

> Conflating things like rbST or rBGH in milk with novel genes in corn is nothing but scientific illiteracy.

Yeah, so what? Nobody said anything else. It's still "a trust issue not a 'science' one", because most people are scientifically illiterate and probably always will be. To make a majority trust science (again [?]) in stead of distrusting it will have to be done by some other means than educating everyone into scientists.

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