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Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

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Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#221

Post by endisneigh »

TaupeRanger wrote: post #215
endisneigh wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s no contradiction between your quote and the headline: schools opened and suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed, but the relationship isn't necessarily causal.

Kind of a silly reply. The headline could've just avoided the implication. Imagine the headline: "women started eating more beans, and birth defects skyrocketed". What will people assume, regardless of the content of the article? It's clickbaity, that's the problem.

What's clickbaity about it though? Schools opened and suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed. I didn't necessarily think it was causal, but rather a correlation. I mean if you read the article then what they're trying to say is clear in any case. YMMV.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#222

Post by jokab »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #211
Nullabillity wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, focusing on school and "your future" 24/7 is a great way to end up alone, sad, and directionless in some apartment later in life. Or in a ditch somewhere, when the pressure gets too much.

Those types typically land in the corner office in a skyscraper, or riding a dick into space. A problem few of us will have, with a simple solution.

If its that simple, why arent you riding a dick towards space?

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#223

Post by dogman144 »

yowlingcat wrote: post #145
austincheney wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Freeing children from nonsense like drugs and social media isn’t holding them back. My children’s social development occurs in the real world where they participate in sports and educational activities and spend time with friends offline. Social media isn’t real socializing.

> Freeing children from nonsense like drugs and social media isn’t holding them back But surveilling on them will. You're using your own active involvement as a crutch to compensate for the fact that you can't leave them to their own devices and know they'll do the right thing. But how can they do that if you don't teach them and you don't give them the right chance to show they can do it? You're not teaching them to…

I was part of the set of kids who had the first versions of Net Nanny and “find my iPhone” equivalents rolled out.

NetNanny, which was basically a very visible firewall, automatically incentivized a search for more network access, and treating that access like a fat kid in a candy store for much longer than I’m happy with today.

The early “find my iPhone” tech that cell providers rolled out probably worked well until it sent me, a 16 y/o with angst issues, a text saying my cell phone was now enrolled and being tracked. Fairly enraging at the time.

The counter though is with some knowledge of silent firewalls and IAM, I could see considering something similar But significantly More silent, as a parent.

There is fairly shocking discussion around kidsporn accessserious issues with healthy sexuality. Screen time is turning young kids into zombies; there is just no planet where unrestricted tech access is good for the growing brain. The current Gen pop attitudes towards tech don’t offer much form of support - their kids are buried in an iPhone, my personal parenting policy will be a inherent critique of their parenting. PTAs see no issue with default Facebook use, thus enrolling my children in an data logging system I specifically work to avoid.

Add in disinfo campaigns and the young mind…

All this to say: invisible training wheels, or rather invisible walls and some tracking, seem to be the only way to raise a kid who must know tech, but won’t learn how to handle full exposure to it until well after 18 (bc adults are struggling too). Conversely, if that surveillance is discovered, it’s hell to pay as a parent. Tricky.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#224

Post by prepend »

isthisreality wrote: post #94
prepend wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yet did the successful suicide rate in males increase to compensate? It seems like you have a duty, out of politeness, to at least address whether you attempted to address this. Bringing up makes suicide rates vs female without trying to address if that explains a 50v3% increase in attempts isn’t very helpful, or interesting.

Maybe instead of complaining, you can look it up yourself and contribute the data to this thread.

I thought about that, but it’s the duty of the person bringing it up. I don’t want to spend my time fixing the mistakes of others when it’s outside my direct interest.

My hope was to encourage the parent commenter to add some basic data to their worst.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#225

Post by dogman144 »

patrickdavey wrote: post #179
ianai wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree. Those tend to be the most functional relationships/young adults that I remember interacting with in the past. Social media though is clearly a thing to approach carefully. I personally just block it all at the firewall and watch for the day society gets through this phase.

Terribly basic question, but, can they not just use a VPN to tunnel through? I've heard kids are doing that kind of thing now.

It all has to pass through a router at some point, and the VPN will have a specific signature especially around connecting to the VPN server itself. Might have to put your threat hunting hat on to find it though. If my kid really does start getting clever there, then we start talking about CTFs and the wonderful world and compensation of Infosec.

If cellular, I’d roll with family iPhones and app restrictions on the kids’ phones, plus a lot of careful messaging.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#226

Post by sodality2 »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #65
sodality2 wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would it not be inverse or negative correlation, instead?

Something has gone wrong when you want to describe a positive correlation as "negative".

Well that can easily be switched just by the variables... for example:

isolation factor (ie, lockdowns) vs depression rates. When isolation factor decreases (lockdown releases), depression rates increase. Negative correlation.

Social contact (ie, lockdown releases) vs depression rates. When lockdowns release and social contact increases, depression rates increase. Positive correlation.

If it was straightforward coordinate plane values like to describe the slope of a line, you can't really easily reverse the correlation just by redefining the variables.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#227

Post by jokethrowaway »

While I believe schools to be terrible (great for seeing, meeting people; terrible for the forced curriculum down your throat part), I disagree with the author's reading (even if correlation doesn't imply causation) that points at school being bad for kids.

This could very well be the effect of a year of lockdown and having to go back in the real world. If that's the case, we'll see the number of suicides drop over the next years.

Lockdowns caused me to fall into depression again but I never thought about killing myself. There was always hope that things would eventually go back to normal, you were .

Now that the normal is back and I'm confronted with a reality which is partially worse than lockdown times (eg. having to go back to the office for employees, having to go to school instead of studying on zoom for students) I have a year of mental issues which I didn't fix, I'm burnt out, there is nothing else to wait for which will magically improve my life and I'm faced with the challenges of the pre-lockdown world. It doesn't surprise me to see suicides going up.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#228

Post by mjfl »

voisin wrote: post #53
mprovost wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Instagram was founded in 2010.

I am not disagreeing but I am interested to know which specific factors make it so different from things in the past. I remember growing up and the boogeyman was sexualized videos on MTV and violent video games. I didn’t believe it then and I don’t quite believe it now. Not to say I don’t believe social media has negative impacts but this is a pretty sharp rise. It also coincided with the post-2009 financial crisis.…

> Could be more financially unstable households.

In my schooling experience I don't think I remember there being a correlation between household wealth and mental health issues. There were poor kids who didn't engage at all with the stress of preparing for the future and therefore had a great time in middle / high school (their suffering came later...) and many kids with richer parents who put them through grueling schooling regimens, with very high standards and conditional love, which led to lots of problems with anxiety / depression.

I think a lot of problems came from the remote schooling being really bad for time management. Kids got bad grades, felt like their lives were ruined. This is something I think is happening a lot.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#229

Post by austincheney »

iamstupidsimple wrote: post #202
austincheney wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it an island if they socialize in the real world? They text their friends from the real world and share memes with each other all day. They don’t need a social media account to do any of that.

Here on this website, we spend an awful lot of time discussing how one person remote working on a team who are in-person can easily lead to being forgotten. This is similar. When somebody is putting an event together and goes through their contact list on FB, you not being there puts you at a small disadvantage. If you're socially awkward in-person, it can really set you back.

It makes me wonder how these socially inept people lived life before Facebook ran their lives for them. Perhaps they cared about things more than following some high school drop out they once knew in a prior life decades before.

Re: Schools opened, suicide attempts in girls skyrocketed

#230

Post by 0xEFF »

austincheney wrote: post #61
Dumblydorr wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would you handle it if they begged, pleaded, and explained how all their friends use it and it'd be social ostracism to not use it? I'm not a parent yet but I dread this situation. I'm good at denying urges personally, so I'd tell them desire is a constant part of life, we can't always get what we crave. Further, I'd state actual facts about girls mental health, they will see and be exposed to unhealthy mindsets…

[flagged]

Caution is warranted on the you can have it if you can pay for it route.

An enterprising teenager may earn money in undesirable ways.

I’m a parent and I’m thinking I’ll handle this as a clear you can have it or you can’t to avoid the grey and black market incentives.

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