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What it's like to be cancelled

noahbradley.com

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Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#221

Post by FemmeAndroid »

I cannot imagine a colleague writing the following and not being fired, and effectively outcast from most employers in my industry, especially when it’s happening at industry events:

> I was terrible to women.

> I preyed on them. I ceaselessly hit on them. I pressured them into sex. I got too drunk and did all manner of dumb things. Yes, I was one of those shitty, creepy sexual predators you hear about.

I work in a fairly established industry, and that would be completely unacceptable. Even if it happened decades ago. I’ve seen people be fired for much less inappropriate behavior.

In the article, Noah writes:

> I had changed my behavior long before my apology was written last year. I had figured out why I had done what I had, why it was unhealthy, and how to change.

I’d love to read more about that process. His past behaviors and the similar behaviors of many other men - drunkenly pressuring women into sex - negatively affect far more people than cancelling does.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#222

Post by Ensorceled »

There has to be room among the woke for the awakening or we never make progress.

I think this is the essence of any legitimate criticism of cancel culture. The lack of nuance and the lack of room.

Do I ever want to see Bill Cosby or OJ Simpson in a new role? No. Some levels of horrible are unforgivable. Cancel away.

Woody Allen. Same.

Louis C.K.? Maybe? Unlikely. Certainly not until he makes some kind of real effort/apology/reparations.

Noah Bradley? Assuming this article is accurate and sincere? There are a lot of Noah Bradley's in the world, do they deserve a second chance?

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#223

Post by rchaud »

steveBK123 wrote: post #38
MattGaiser wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of it is that journalists will amplify it as well if they are one of the 100 who sees it. Seen journalist job postings where checking Twitter for stories is part of it.

Journalists participate in Twitter at a rate probably 10-100x the overall population. Most people don't ever log into Twitter, most journalists do daily. I think you can look at it this way: * For normal people, Twitter is not real life. * For journalists, Twitter is real life. Journalists then become the vector by which BS Twitter drama becomes mainstreamed.

If you know how to play the game, this is a huge asset. Marc Andreessen said in a New Yorker interview that he ignored Twitter until he realized that the media were obssessed with it. Andreessen Horowitz the VC firm started relatively late compared to some others, but it shot to the top of mindshare because of the constant stream of coverage they gave Andreessen and his intentionally outrageous visions of the future.

Elon Musk does this as well, just without any pretense of subtlety.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#224

Post by jader201 »

WA wrote: post #157
laurent123456 wrote: post #100

It seems it's better to stay away entirely from certain sensitive topics. No matter your intentions, no matter what you actually think, it just takes a bit of misunderstanding or bad faith and the whole thing explode.

No, just post anonymously. Way better. Then your voice is heard, but you don't have to suffer personal consequences.

The irony is that taken out of context, this one sentiment sums up everything that is wrong with the internet and, more specifically, social media.

When removed from consequences to our actions, we’re free to say pretty much anything we want.

If everyone actually cared about the impact our words had on others, we wouldn’t have to resort to the using the same response that caused the problem in the first place.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#225

Post by throwaway111999 »

I'm terrified of interacting with female coworkers.

I don't have a "-ist" bone in my body. When I review code, I only see the code and not the person that wrote it. When I pick a team, I look at engineering ability and nothing else. I abhor discriminatory behavior and would be the first to put my career on the line to defend someone getting discriminated against. And of course I keep anything sexual FAR FAR FAAAR outside of work.

Sometimes I write "guys" in chat (out of habit) and get a rush of anxiety. Did I offend someone? Should I correct it? If I correct it, will it make it more obvious? What if I get called out for using that word? How should I respond without making myself look like a goon?

I've stopped giving negative feedback. It started when I needed to give negative feedback to a female engineer who wasn't doing well. I was terrified of being perceived as sexist so I just gave neutral/positive feedback to protect myself. I didn't want it to look bad so I did the same for male coworkers. Now I just give everyone positive feedback all the time. Yea, it looks like I'm a doormat or just dumb but it's worth the sense of safety I feel.

I never EVER make jokes at work. I don't tell stories about my life. I certainly don't share political opinions. I don't talk about my hobbies because those might (at some point, not now) be correlated with something "-ist". Not worth the risk.

I obviously don't post on social media. I do intend to start at some point, but everything I post will go through a heavy handed PR filter. I'm thinking it'll all be positive/supportive. No complaining, no calling anyone out, no responding to politicians or popular figures, and definitely never supporting anyone that I don't know personally.

It's exhausting but at least it's opt-in. I just want a calm day to day life.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#226

Post by tester756 »

throwaway34017 wrote: post #56

I recently gave a test lecture about a topic in statistics, where I showed a meme that a statistics professor I follow shared on her Twitter feed [1]. I thought it would be safe to include as it didn't get any negative reactions on Twitter and was already being used by a professor in her university class in the US. After the talk I immediately got called out by the women's representative on the hiring commission, who…

on one hand I can see why would somebody think it's not the nicest thing to show

but on the other hand - holy **, you better get thick skin quick enough, because life's gonna be way harsher than this.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#227

Post by etcet »

LegitShady wrote: post #109
fration wrote: post #58

You did not get cancelled for questionable comments online, or wrongthink, or whatever. You got burned for being a sexual predator. Stop making posts about it online, stop downplaying what you did by saying "I was a different person". Learn to live with the consequences of your actions.

define sexual predator

"I was terrible to women. I preyed on them. I ceaselessly hit on them. I got too drunk and did all manner of dumb things. Yes, I pressured them into sex. I was one of those shitty, creepy sexual predators you hear about" [0]

[0] https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/0...

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#228

Post by dkjaudyeqooe »

systemvoltage wrote: post #200
3grdlurker wrote: post #181

We talk about cancel culture like it’s a new horrible thing that’s developed only recently but I don’t see it that way. The internet definitely amplifies the effects, but unkindness begets unkindness, and the consequences or the social cost of one’s unkindness will always catch up to an individual at some point. That said, I draw a line at defamation. When someone is accusing someone online of having committed a crim…

If you read the article, even before anything gets to court, their life/career is destroyed because of this mob. Proving/disproving isn’t even on the table. This is an irrational mob gaining moral superiority over others.

"Irrational mob" also known as "social media".

We've just scaled up and weaponised people's bad behavior and worst instincts. People have always been this way but now they have a tool to find other like minded people and act in unison.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#229

Post by allenu »

hexenduction wrote: post #201

Anyone go dig up the public apology from last year? No wonder it isn't linked, it literally is him saying he preyed on women, and pressured them into sex, with alcohol involved, verbatim, I'm not trying to stretch it. Turning that around into his own personal trauma narrative from the consequences of those actions is really hitting the wrong nerve for me here. Sure, apologize, learn and grow, people can change, but m…

I read that apology as well and came away with a different opinion from what the post title wants you to think.

This seems like a very interesting branding approach on his part. Play up allegations and subsequent firing as being "cancelled" and come back as a victim of mob rule. Certainly a blog post that said "What it's like to feel the consequences of your actions" wouldn't have been as effective. (I suppose you could argue it's unfair to be fired for his behavior since it wasn't work related but I assume he was representing his employer at these art shows and it's bad for their brand to have him on staff.)

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