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Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

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Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#221

Post by MauranKilom »

firebaze wrote: post #136

I use a Huawei matebook D14 as my personal device. Its primary use is in a WiFi-network (as in 99% of the time). Since I also use MS devices in the same network I log all IPs being accessed from my network ( https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/configuration/wire... ) I'll leave the log results of accessed IPs as an exercise to the reader. Hint: no chinese/russian IP addresses are being accessed. I'd guess a lot…

> Hint: no chinese/russian IP addresses are being accessed.

As Snowden revealed, the NSA itself is way above that playing field. They (quite unsurprisingly) use IPs in the respective country, or just false-flag IPs in "enemy" countries. And the data is not actually sent as plain packets but tacked in the form of metadata onto normal, innocent packets going elsewhere. Then servers on intermediate hops exfiltrate that data. And none of it might happen if you're not actually targeted.

That of course underlines your main point. I don't see "sends nothing to foreign IPs" as an argument though.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#222

Post by zeusk »

yumraj wrote: post #162
itsoktocry wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> American company will collect data to show you ads and profit Unless you get a target on your back, in which case the American company will provide the American law enforcement agencies with whatever data they want to take action against you and your family. Your assertion is just a variation of "if you're not doing anything wrong you shouldn't worry about spying".

> Your assertion is just a variation of "if you're not doing anything wrong you shouldn't worry about spying". Really, that is what you got from my comment. In the case of CCP it can even be who you are, as in Tibetan, Uighur and so on.. Or, a national of a different country that China wants to spy on, or a relative of someone that China thinks has a differing opinion from CCP and so on.. It's not even on the same pl…

well under the trump administration, we were at the state where ICE was getting tips from unlawful traffic stops and deporting said immigrants/refugees.

They're both evil, just that US is less so.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#223

Post by Daho0n »

yumraj wrote: post #165
AlexandrB wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> American company will collect data to show you ads and profit. 7 years later and it's like Snowden never even existed. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PRISM_(surveillance_program)

Fair enough, if we want argue along those lines - if you're in country X, would you like to be spied on by your country's gov AND China? I, for one, would prefer, if I have a choice, it to be just my Gov and not a foreign Gov that I consider to be hostile..

Would I rather have some data harvested by the local three letter agency and some by a random Chinese company versus all my data harvested by an American entity (most western three letter agencies share with the US)? I would most definitely rather have them out of the reach of US spying even if it means sending it to China instead. You might consider PRC hostile but how much do you think it takes for your data to get US agents come knocking on your door versus PRC agents? Sure today it might not happen but in your parents youth it could have. In your children's lifetime your words today might harm them.

The short version is that unless you live inside the PRC data harvested on you is highly unlikely to matter no matter what you do. Inside the US or US allies? Be careful.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#224

Post by xtian »

ethbr0 wrote: post #220
tehjoker wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys are familiar with the Snowden disclosures and how all telecom companies and very likely all major tech companies are spying for the US government right? At this point, this is table stakes for big tech and it's completely anti-democratic. China may have a very good domestic dragnet but clearly it's playing catch up compared to the foreign intelligence assets the USG (and five eyes) has.

If you're going to cite Snowden, please be accurate. Remember that one of the leaks was that the NSA tapped unencrypted Google backhaul in transit without Google's knowledge . There's a difference between panopticon fearmongering and citing specific information we should be wary of. The former leads to apathy. The latter leads to action.

How about this one? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#225

Post by Daho0n »

karaterobot wrote: post #100
cwhiz wrote: post #29

Chinese browser collects your data? Spyware. American company collects your data? $1,400,000,000,000 valuation. This reminds me of how we call Russian billionaires "oligarchs" but we just call American billionaires...billionaires.

I don't grant your premise that the U.S. government's level of access to Google data is the same as the Chinese government's access to Xiaomi's. I also don't grant that the two governments are equivalent threats to privacy. You would need to demonstrate both of those things for me to be on board with your argument. But, the point I actually want to make is that this implies that people aren't concerned with Google's…

> I also don't grant that the two governments are equivalent threats to privacy

So for someone like me, living in a 14 eyes country, are you saying it is worse for my privacy that a government on the other side of the earth that my government doesn't really like might have access to some of my data is better compared to a country my government are sharing data with who also have access to pretty much everything that happens online? I know for a fact that no matter what I say or do online PRC agents will never knock down my door. US agents? That would be quite a lot easier. In less serious waters, privacy is also worse as we know from Snowden that the US not only harvest everything it can but it also share it with US businesses. Will I ever see ads based on an algorithm trained on data from both sides? No idea, but I know which one would be worse for me by a long shot.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#226

Post by trasz »

monkeyingaround wrote: post #60

Xiaomi phones are insane, at least BlackShark. They replace virtually all the major user level stuff of Android with extreme data collecting alternatives. They then make it so that you cannot disable many of them (via adp, custom ROMs etc.) without bricking the phone, I'm talking wallpaper or clock apps that run with full, non-modifiable privileges. They subsidize cheap hardware with truly insane level of tracking. T…

So how is it different from a regular Android again?

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#227

Post by bigiain »

kelnos wrote: post #207
Daho0n wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About your second edit: If you live anywhere on earth that isn't in the geographical area of China it would likely be better to have data going to China than the big US corps. For most it is unlikely the data could be used against you in anything from ads to a police raid, unlike with something like Google collecting it where it will almost for sure be used and useful.

I hear this a lot, but it strikes me as being short sighted. That only works if the status quo remains so forever. Maybe 5 or 10 years from now, relations between the Chinese and US governments gets cozier, and part of their deal includes sharing of this kind of data. Or maybe the US government knows it can't legally collect certain information on its own citizens, but can rely on China to collect it, and then purcha…

We know about five eyes.

The pessimist in me assumes that's because it's a good cover for the intelligence agencies data sharing agreements between the US, China, India, Russian, North Korea, et al.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#228

Post by Daho0n »

neltnerb wrote: post #86
Kelamir wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you elaborate your point?

Apologies for not finding citations, but as an example of... suspicious behavior... Firefox had a big campaign about blocking Facebook tracking with a big push to install an addon to reduce Facebook data collection. They did not do that with Google. That's the one that stood out to me as especially asymmetric, others may have other examples they remember. Don't get me wrong, Firefox is clearly the best of the options…

Firefox puts Google in its own container just like Facebook. It also block third party cookies and is way better at avoiding fingerprinting than chrome.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#229

Post by trasz »

at-fates-hands wrote: post #98
lucideer wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not 100% sure from your comment whether you're making out that: (a). China is bad (yes, known) (b). The US is not quite as bad (debatable but for the sake of argument lets agree that this is true) (c). The US is benign My comment was only refuting the 3rd supposition. I'm not sure if you actually believe this is true. Though terms such as "country with a functioning democracy" make me think you might...

> My comment was only refuting the 3rd supposition. I'm not sure if you actually believe this is true. The country is an imperfect union. Although the country attempts at every turn to work towards "A more perfect Union"; clearly we have similar issues that other countries do. In a comparative analysis, OP was merely saying the US is head and shoulders above a country that suppresses freedom of speech, eliminates pol…

How are those different from American concentration camps, such as Guantanamo?

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#230

Post by Daho0n »

gkbrk wrote: post #42
sandworm101 wrote: post #24

>>The article accuses Xiaomi of exfiltrating a history of all visited websites. Is this our definition of spyware? I see countless articles float by on HN about super cookies, spy pixels and browser fingerprinting. Those do effectively the same things, track users against their expressed wishes, but we just don't call them spyware.

>We just don't call them spyware. Who doesn't call trackers spyware? Everyone with a slightly-above-average sense of privacy has been calling them spyware and blocking them for years.

Chrome is popular on HN so you are wrong, sadly.
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