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Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

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Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#221

Post by honkycat »

Public hangings, an event where you could go and watch someone be drug out into the town square and hung from the neck until they were dead, used to be an event people would gather to see.

People used to fill bags with cats, dose the bag in oil, and then light the bag on fire for the joy of watching the cats die from the fire.

During combat sports you are watching two fully grown people destroy their brains and their bodies for your enjoyment. People regularly died from these sports.

Video games have no stakes. Even children understand this. Clicking on a pixelated simulation of a nondescript soldier who always comes back for the next round is Disney cartoons compared to what people used to get up to.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#222

Post by GTP »

kiliancs wrote: post #205
mywittyname wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, part of this is probably also some degree of us intuitively knowing the answer. If you have a friend group of 10 people, 4 of which regularly work out. You will probably notice that those 4 friends have less body fat and are more toned than the other 6. At that point, if a study came out saying that working out had no impact on body physique, you'd reflexively question the results. That might sound ridiculous…

Intuitively, it's hard to believe that witnessing and using violence doesn't have any negative effect on a person, even if in videogames. I think that rather than asking ourselves "does this have a negative impact?" we should ask "what can I do that has a positive impact?". Personally, I would never work on a game with significant violence. From my point of view, there are so many other things a human being can contr…

I rarely play videogames, but when I do, I usually play FPSs. I think that a small dose of virtual violence could help in discharging your stress/anger.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#223

Post by scotty79 »

qrybam wrote: post #4

I think for those of us who have played any amount of shooters can attest that the game itself wouldn’t make you any more violent. It’s one of those “common sense” things that for non gamers seems obvious: “violent games make you more violent”, and the for the gamers out there the opposite is true, it’s obvious that they don’t.

Yeah. After a game of pew pew you simply don't feel like getting up and out to f__k s__t up. If you play to your satisfaction you just feel like doing something entirely different for a while.

With possible exception of multiplayer games that you loose too much. Those things can enrage you.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#224

Post by throwaway0a5e »

Avamander wrote: post #168
rgblambda wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Learning to become dependent on external intervention for all conflict is not a life skill I want to teach my kids. If someone breaks into my house and tries to beat me to death, I'm not going to try to reason it out with them, I'm calling the police.

I think we all very clearly know that there are exceptions where you do need to ask for external help.

For people not institutionalized with a jailer or nurse in close proximity there is no "external help" that has a useful SLA if you unexpectedly find yourself in a situation where bodily harm is imminent. You either need to prevent the situation from happening yourself or deal with it yourself.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#225

Post by techlaw »

kiliancs wrote: post #205
mywittyname wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, part of this is probably also some degree of us intuitively knowing the answer. If you have a friend group of 10 people, 4 of which regularly work out. You will probably notice that those 4 friends have less body fat and are more toned than the other 6. At that point, if a study came out saying that working out had no impact on body physique, you'd reflexively question the results. That might sound ridiculous…

Intuitively, it's hard to believe that witnessing and using violence doesn't have any negative effect on a person, even if in videogames. I think that rather than asking ourselves "does this have a negative impact?" we should ask "what can I do that has a positive impact?". Personally, I would never work on a game with significant violence. From my point of view, there are so many other things a human being can contr…

I work with a nonprofit group that does this. We produce prosocial video games intentionally designed to encourage prosocial outcomes.

The published studies (two so far) support their effectiveness. It's not easy to get the word out though without the funds for a publicist, advertising, etc.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#226

Post by Quarrelsome »

umvi wrote: post #170
mywittyname wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, part of this is probably also some degree of us intuitively knowing the answer. If you have a friend group of 10 people, 4 of which regularly work out. You will probably notice that those 4 friends have less body fat and are more toned than the other 6. At that point, if a study came out saying that working out had no impact on body physique, you'd reflexively question the results. That might sound ridiculous…

There's some truth here, but it's important not to use anecdotes too much to guide intuition because the sample size is often too small and too biased. For example, I have a group of 10 friends. All 10 of them (including myself) got covid, and we all agree it is no worse than the flu. I mean, yeah, we couldn't smell or taste for a few days, but we all recovered within a week. Therefore... I should reflexively questio…

well to put it another way; in the time that I have lived violent video games have exploded in popularity and violent crime has apparently decreased substantially. That's not to say there's causality between the two but it would definitely support the premise that violent video games at least don't encourage violent crime.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#227

Post by diarmuid »

longdefeat wrote: post #215
kiliancs wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Intuitively, it's hard to believe that witnessing and using violence doesn't have any negative effect on a person, even if in videogames. I think that rather than asking ourselves "does this have a negative impact?" we should ask "what can I do that has a positive impact?". Personally, I would never work on a game with significant violence. From my point of view, there are so many other things a human being can contr…

-we should ask "what can I do that has a positive impact?"- That's part of the point of this essay that was on HN last year: "Fortnite and the Good Life," which seems relevant here. https://theconvivialsociety.substack.com/p/the-convivial-soc...

headshot === positive impact

they are just games and most (non crazy) people understand that

like hansel and gretel when they push the witch in the oven - its fiction and not intended to be a guide to life

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#228

Post by saba2008 »

wwtrv wrote: post #138
raztogt21 wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm from Mexico too. Kids (males mostly) playing with toys guns or swords is normal. Almost all games/sports are microcosms for wars, football, basketball, tag, hide n seek. Both kids and adults love these microcosms of war. They don't pretend to be narcos because they like toy guns. They do it because they aspire to a quality of life they will never get via a normal working job.

The third paragraph kind of contradicts the second one one. I mean why don’t they pretend to be businessmen, politicians or investment bankers then?

Because there are no successful businessman, politicians or investment bankers in their social circle.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#229

Post by ohdannyboy »

Doing a quick review of the literature I can find shows we don't have a completely clear picture yet. The link in young children is definitive and the link in adolescents is murky but it looks like one of many risk factors. I am inclined to entirely disregard the linked study as garbage since it gives a very definitive black-and-white answer that is in opposition to highly cited literature. I think the main reason it is at the top of HN is that we want this to be the simple black-and-white answer.

As someone who grew up with violent video games I think this issue is taken way too personally by most of us. The idea that video games will necessarily make you violent is absurd and not being proposed by anyone (that is mostly a straw man used to dismiss the idea). The question is whether violent video games can push some kids over the edge -- kids who are already predisposed to violence. Imagine an abused kid with no farther figure who would probably be a violent teen anyways. Will playing violent videogames numb him to the idea of killing, give him neural pathways that make the repetitive action more likely and start him with some bad ideas? Could it be the difference between him getting in some fist fights and indiscriminately murdering schoolchildren? The answer looks like "yes."

The case made in the book On Combat is very interesting. That book is considered one of the definitive secondary works on combat psychology and he spends significant time on this question. I strongly recommend the book.

Re: Ten year study: No link between violent video games and aggressive behavior

#230

Post by tomp »

aidenn0 wrote: post #194
umvi wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's some truth here, but it's important not to use anecdotes too much to guide intuition because the sample size is often too small and too biased. For example, I have a group of 10 friends. All 10 of them (including myself) got covid, and we all agree it is no worse than the flu. I mean, yeah, we couldn't smell or taste for a few days, but we all recovered within a week. Therefore... I should reflexively questio…

To put it a different way, the people who grew up to be violent individuals are probably not posting on HN, nor working at companies with people who post on HN, so the fact that everybody on HN isn't violent, despite playing violent video games is only weak evidence against there being a correlation. In fact, I would be surprised for there to be zero correlation (even assuming there is no causation), as it is a reaso…

> as it is a reasonable assumption that naturally violent people are more likely to play violent video games.

It's also a reasonable assumption that people who naturally want to avoid actual violence play violent video games instead.

This paranoia against violent video games was obviously fake from the start, and such a typically American thing - in line with the American puritan view that blowing up people in films or broadcasting police car chases is a-OK but (female) nipples or saying "fuck" is a big NO NO.

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