Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up • Hacker News Board

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#221

Post by narag » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 8:54 PM UTC

AmVess wrote: post #165

nextos wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also stopped buying at Amazon after 15 years. Even consumables and small items are problematic. Just in the last year, I encountered many issues including: * Showerhead that came without box, and clearly used. It still had a lot of water inside! * Underwear from a brand that sells items inside a sealed bag and discards returns came used, without bag (yuck!) * A module of Samsung RAM had visible wear signs and di…

I won't be buying anything expensive from Amazon anymore. I ordered a 2TB nvme SSD which came in a padded envelope. I didn't even try it before returning it. Its own packing was a simple blister pack. $250 I ordered a camera lens which also came in a padded envelope. $400. I got a box of wet wipes from them. It had its own sturdy box and they were placed in another box lined with shipping paper. $12. I also won't buy…

But is expensive the problem? Of course I don't buy anything above 100€, but neither anything computer related, clothes or in general things that I can walk ten minutes and buy in a physical shop.

Most of what I buy are products that I can't find offline easily or at all. So Amazon actually brings them sooner than what I would be able to find it offline, like vitamins or exotic incense. Also some audio electronics are too expensive in the few shops that, even in Madrid, are specialized in that area.

But computers or phones or monitors/tv? MediaMarkt or Fnac have a good enough variety and I can just walk out the shop with a box, that I can return no questions asked if defective, the same day.

I've also found out that some pieces of audio electronics or instruments are better bought used from individuals. I got a pair of pro speakers for 100€ that are triple that money new. You can go and see the thing before paying. Same for furniture that is dirty cheap used.

Edit: could be this related to USA car dependence?

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#222

Post by sokoloff » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 8:54 PM UTC

wiz21c wrote: post #183

nextos wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also stopped buying at Amazon after 15 years. Even consumables and small items are problematic. Just in the last year, I encountered many issues including: * Showerhead that came without box, and clearly used. It still had a lot of water inside! * Underwear from a brand that sells items inside a sealed bag and discards returns came used, without bag (yuck!) * A module of Samsung RAM had visible wear signs and di…

Not to sound bitter, but why the heck do you buy so much on Amazon (you and others on this HN formum) ? Isn't it clear from the premises that that whole online thing is treacherous at best for the environment, our environment ? I can understand the convenience, buying stuff you don't find in your local shops, etc. But much of what Amazon do is because they have customers... So instead of complaining about Amazon, why…

I’m not so sure that a local electronics shop is way more ecological. More HVAC, more lighting, items shipped to an intermediate warehouse, then reshipped, then maybe transferred between stores, then customers driving their SUVs around shopping.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Amazon can get me a TV with lower total emissions than if I shopped locally. If I comparison shopped locally, I’m virtually certain Amazon’d win.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#223

Post by baby » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 8:57 PM UTC

sokoloff wrote: post #3

> 30 to 40 per cent of all online purchases are sent back That seems almost an order of magnitude higher than I’d expect. Setting aside kids shoes (which probably do get 50% returned), I can’t imagine sending back even 5% of my online purchases, let alone 30-40%. I think I’ve sent back exactly 1 Amazon order in the last year, out of nearly 100.

That is quite an insane number! What a waste or back and forth, and this because cities are not dense in the US and everything was built around cars. I probably return less than 5% of what I buy, but my gf returns a lot of the clothes she buys online.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#224

Post by mcv » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 8:58 PM UTC

mrweasel wrote: post #206

mcv wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife also buys a lot of clothes online, and indeed it's a matter of fitting and sending back what doesn't fit. I recently did it too: ordered two pairs of pants, one was fine, the other didn't look remotely like what I ordered, so I sent it back. In shops, you can try them on. Online, I think it's unavoidable that people try them on at home and send more than half of their clothes purchases back. Standardisation i…

You basically cannot provide enough measurement to ensure that clothing will fit. There's an article about the US Air Force and the "average pilot" https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2016/01/16/when-us-air-... The gist of it is: The average pilot doesn't exists. I'd assume it's not much different with clothing. While the length for instance may fit, the shape of a sleeve or trouser leg may prevent you from wearing…

Maybe with a full 3D scan of the body. But even then, clothes fit differently depending on the material: stretch, non-stretch, thick, thin, etc.

But everything would have to be pretty much tailor made. If you could do that on demand and automated, taking into account all these factors and making it as personalised as possible, that might really cut back on some clothes waste. But I have no idea whether this is technically possible, and it's definitely going to be a hard problem to solve.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#225

Post by savanaly » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:06 PM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #182

bigwavedave wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess I really know nothing about economics... Sincere question: how does paying less for functionally/fashionably equivalent products hurt the economy of the country that's consuming them?

The same detrimental effects can happen with lots of aid given to Africa. Basically, the majority of Africa is clothed with first world hand-me-downs. The result is that there is virtually no market for home-grown clothing makers in Africa. Think about it, the US has "anti-dumping" laws to protect US manufacturers, but we "dump" into other countries all the time in the form of "aid".

Isn't this just the broken window fallacy though? Creating work is not a good thing in and of itself.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#226

Post by lmilcin » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:07 PM UTC

sokoloff wrote: post #3

> 30 to 40 per cent of all online purchases are sent back That seems almost an order of magnitude higher than I’d expect. Setting aside kids shoes (which probably do get 50% returned), I can’t imagine sending back even 5% of my online purchases, let alone 30-40%. I think I’ve sent back exactly 1 Amazon order in the last year, out of nearly 100.

That's because returns are not due to faulty products, they are due to people trying to exploit the system.

I have bought hundreds of items on Amazon and never had to send back any. I bought thousands, of different types, on other services and I only ever had to send back two and that due to the fact the seller sent a wrong item.

I always do at least a very quick research regarding the seller and the item so that probably helps.

But the 30% I can understand is due to people who never intend to buy the product or buy a bunch of them to send some back.

I can sort of understand it in some of the categories (for example clothes) but I also see a lot of people proclaiming how smart they are because they surf on the wave of products they never pay for.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#227

Post by jrochkind1 » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:07 PM UTC

ThePhysicist wrote: post #83

In Germany there are companies that buy up returns by the kilogram (mostly clothes), sometimes the e-commerce companies even pay them to take the goods off their backs. They then ship them to countries like Irak, Serbia or Lebanon to prevent those perfectly goood items to "flood" the European market. That way especially clothing brands protect their inflated prices.

Good thing they don't mind flooding the market in Iraq, Syria, or Lebanon!

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#228

Post by marzell » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:08 PM UTC

nextos wrote: post #63

jjoonathan wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it depends a lot on category. What you said about kids clothing is spot on, but I'd expect similar dynamics for women's clothing (tighter fits = lower tolerance, also lower tolerance for color mismatch etc) and there are a couple of categories that I've outright stopped buying on Amazon because of the enormous problem rate, namely whitelabeled consumer electronics. In 2020 I've returned ~5%: markers that were…

I've also stopped buying at Amazon after 15 years. Even consumables and small items are problematic. Just in the last year, I encountered many issues including: * Showerhead that came without box, and clearly used. It still had a lot of water inside! * Underwear from a brand that sells items inside a sealed bag and discards returns came used, without bag (yuck!) * A module of Samsung RAM had visible wear signs and di…

Amazon also makes zero effort to inform people when they have listings for items and are not an authorized retailer, which invalidates warrantees and leaves consumers with no recourse if there is a manufacturing defect or other problem that would normally be taken care of without issue.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#229

Post by hourislate » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:08 PM UTC

Amazon has become an expensive place to shop for everyday items. I've found they typically don't have the best prices anymore and many of my tastes have changed over the years.

They are still super useful to find those hard to get parts that would typically be impossible to find locally or at least very expensive. Like a carburetor for a chainsaw or a part for an appliance, bearings for a hood fan motor, monitor arm, etc.

A lot of retailers have picked up their game when it comes to online shopping. Places like rockauto.com for auto parts are super competitive and offer a massive inventory (what a great acquisition it would be for AMZN to break into the auto parts sector). Newegg/MicroCenter for PC parts, Costco, etc.

But over all I can't remember the last time I had to return anything and my experience over the last 20 years has been a positive one.

Re: Cameras and secret trackers reveal where Amazon returns end up

#230

Post by Spooky23 » Sat, Oct 10, 2020, 9:13 PM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #84

nextos wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've also stopped buying at Amazon after 15 years. Even consumables and small items are problematic. Just in the last year, I encountered many issues including: * Showerhead that came without box, and clearly used. It still had a lot of water inside! * Underwear from a brand that sells items inside a sealed bag and discards returns came used, without bag (yuck!) * A module of Samsung RAM had visible wear signs and di…

I'm always shocked when I read these comments on HN. I swear it must be just the American Amazon that's so shit, because I literally never had any problems nor know anyone with these problems here in UK. Just this year I'm on 108 orders and counting, every single one of them was fine, working, definitely not used, definitely not counterfeit and delivered within 1 day as promised with Prime. Last year I've had 140 ord…

Perhaps the laws are more strict outside of the US re fraud. Most of the issues I’ve seen on Amazon are directly related to shady third party sellers or commingled inventory.

They are responsive to regulatory action - when I filed a complaint about COVID related price gouging via my state attorney general’s office, they acted within two hours of receipt. A firm hand is effective.