They pay taxes in the UK and we still have functioning communities and community groups.
Do other non-profits pay taxes (eg food banks)? Do mosques and temples also pay tax?
Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
221–230 of 335 posts
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It has survived millennia. By "millennia" you mean "at most 300 years, maybe"?
Here in USA. Oldest churches are from the 4th century elsewhere. For the record: I don't think that priests should be able to buy $50M jets or keep 40% of total land of x country tax free, but they should not be forced to sell buildings because property tax is too high.
edit: got it wrong as per below comment
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#223Earlier quoted context omitted.
A solution to this is to give back the land to the local city and have it handled as cultural heritage, with an authorization to practice religious activities at specific times, but it’s governed by local administration overall. That’s how some cathedrals are managed in europe for instance.
What a perfect way for the state to exercise control over religious organizations! You’d quickly end up with every such state sponsored “church” as disruptive to state interests as the Church of England, the Lutheran State Churches of Scandinavia or the Chinese Catholic Patriotic Association.
China aside given that it's an authoritarian state I much prefer the control the state has over the church here in Germany, because it eliminates virtually all religious sectarianism and has led to the church having adopted teaching and a curriculum that is largely in line with the basic constitutional law and secular values rather than existing outside of it. Same in the UK or Scandinavia.
One of the reasons Islamic extremism is so hard to combat is because Islam exists largely outside of the control of the state, as backyard mosques can basically preach anything regardless how extremist it is, often deliberately recruiting people out of organizations that try to integrate with the state and society at large. I assume this is similar to radical Evangelicalism in the US.
Parallel societies are bad, they're a breeding ground for extremism.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#224Churches are one of the biggest business entities in any part of the world. Most churches are structured like a proper business entity (Eg. they have equivalent of directors, CEOs and managers) and have revenue targets and KPIs set. Most churches are also located in some of the prime real estate of top tier cities and I always wondered how they were able to afford paying $1500+/Sq.M in a prime, central area. About th…
Most churches are located on expensive real estate? And most are run like big businesses? And you know for a fact that charity work is less than 10% of income?
These are bold statements that need sources other than some guy you know.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#225Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, let's just give up on making the world a better place. We might never reach Utopia, but we can for damn sure get closer especially if we free ourselves from dogmatic thinking. Do you really want to settle for better than nothing?
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That system that failed everywhere and people found the excuse that it was not applied right, but the idea is sound. I lost my younger years living in such a regime, thanks but no thanks.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#226Earlier quoted context omitted.
I was born in the exUSSR and there, if you want to find the most apocalyptic, neglected, boring and useless building which lives by renting out itself to some strange businesses (if at all), you can ask for the local community center.
Have you considered that you might just be jaded? Why should a 1980 USSR concrete building be your idea of the best that a "community center" can be, in the USA in 2020? Doesn't your complaint have more to do with the USSR than it has to do with community centers?
Yeah this veered off into personal opinion real fast, I'm like we have thousands of Community hubs in Australia and they're great and only getting better.
For example: https://southperth.wa.gov.au/our-future/projects-and-places/...
I didn't even realise there was a connection to Russia until he brought it up.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#227Plain horrible.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#228My whole life was destroyed by religion. I suffered conversion therapy and could never get on hormone blockers young; because of the nonsense faith results in from people with authority over administering a medical treatment. As an adult I'm now trying every year to afford surgeries I cannot afford while my peers save for homes. Also parents disowned me and I have ptsd from the physical & mental abuse. Nice to see re…
I am an atheist, but I don't understand your blame on religion.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#229Earlier quoted context omitted.
So churches should be taxed because they use effective organisational structures and are well run? That’s a new one. You could say the same of well run charities.
You know the point I'm making - It's a business entity because it makes money and manages money like any other business. Why shouldn't it be taxed?
There are an enormous number of (small) churches that don't function as business entities in the way you describe. Taxing churches would adversely select against these, encouraging all churches to behave more like businesses. It's unlikely to me that that's the outcome that anyone wants.
If you think Christianity is broadly good and correct, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors is deeply corrosive to the faith.
If you think Christianity is broadly bad and corrupt, the trend towards business-like megachurches and celebrity pastors entrenches and effectively promulgates many of the religious ideas that you abhor.
Re: Montreal is taxing churches (2017)
#230I acknowledge this is anecdotal but in the Bay Area CA I drive by many churches (of different faiths) occupying large areas of land on prime hilltop real estate. I’m astonished by this.
I am astonished by your astonishment: churches were one of the first buildings to create a nucleus of a new city, so you can say they created the value of that estate out of an empty hilltop in the middle of nowhere.