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Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

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Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#221

Post by aguyfromnb »

lolc wrote: post #86
aguyfromnb wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I like this guy. He has great insight I'm sure customer service people and healthcare professionals love people coming on premises and throwing their weight around with exaggerations and half-truths. The people I know would put you on the bottom of the list.

You're lacking context. It says that when you don't know where to send correspondence at big banks you could try and address investor relations because they are usually bored and will gladly forward your complaint to the right department. This is where the investor part comes in. And only there. Other suggestions are that you could address the legal department because they are diligent by law. Or the CEO, because if…

>Note that the cases talked about involve legal deadlines so knowingly delaying to handle them is not a good option.

Are we reading the same thread? The cases talked about are mundane customer service interactions.

My significant other works in consumer facing healthcare. Every day customers come in proclaiming they "know the owner" or "are a lawyer" or "will take their business elsewhere", expecting to be prioritized. This isn't some clever life-hack; the people who do it are, in my opinion, jerks.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#222

Post by dmitryminkovsky »

tyoma wrote: post #148
dmitryminkovsky wrote: post #56

>A bank: a) Do it only on paper. b) Address to any of Office of the President, Chief Compliance Pfficer, General Counsel, or Investor Relations. My dad speaks English as a second language and asks my family to proofread things. I have no idea where he got this from, but there was a period of time when he'd write letters addressed to the President of JP Morgan, or, The Comptroller of Maryland, etc. At first we all tho…

This is my dad too. I thought he was nuts, but it was very effective. Looking at your name I am going to assume that like me you are from the former USSR. The explanation my dad said is the following: a lifetime of dealing with soviet bureaucracy informed him that orders always flow down, and each worker tries to prevent complaints from flowing up. Therefore, to get a problem resolved, your request has to come from u…

Yep, a child of the late USSR here, but my parents lived through its peak. Your dad's explanation makes a lot of sense.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#223

Post by dmitryminkovsky »

arkitaip wrote: post #160
tyoma wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is my dad too. I thought he was nuts, but it was very effective. Looking at your name I am going to assume that like me you are from the former USSR. The explanation my dad said is the following: a lifetime of dealing with soviet bureaucracy informed him that orders always flow down, and each worker tries to prevent complaints from flowing up. Therefore, to get a problem resolved, your request has to come from u…

Soviet Life Lessons needs to be its own site or at least video series. I'm being serious as someone who lately has been reading up on the Soviet and realizing that its people developed amazing survival skills to deal with the trauma of daily life.

This isn't quite what you're describing, but https://www.youtube.com/channel/UClXTAMdHwvWdmFyOlQmEtpQ

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#224

Post by loco5niner »

sneak wrote: post #209
loco5niner wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. "It's my weekend with my kids" is well understood to mean divorce. It was clearly a lie. Good on OP to recognize it.

No, it can imply divorce, but it does not specify; it is ambiguous. You are assigning explicit communication where there is none, objectively. The listener's assumptions (or lack thereof), which happen after the speaker speaks, cannot retroactively cause the statement to be or not be a lie.

Please provide an example that is not divorce where this phrase applies.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#225

Post by CharlesColeman »

netcan wrote: post #10

This is (hopefully not) obnoxiously off-topic... As a Hebrew speaker, I wish the "shibboleth" idiom (which is a good one) was translated, rather than transliterated. laoned idioms are inherently exotic, and this one is worth demystifying It means any choice of word (or pronunciation, in the literal example) that clearly identifies the speaker's group affiliations. A good modern example is "LondonDerry/Derry. This'd b…

> These tweets are about hacking shibboleths, which is advanced mode. Basic mode would be just noticing shibboleths, and also why and how they so clearly identify speakers.

Yeah. Also using the word "shibboleth" for "advance mode" make some sense, but seems like an uncommon usage. To me, has strong connotations of the "basic mode," i.e. a word use that indirectly gives away someones identity.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#226

Post by netcan »

forgotmypwd123 wrote: post #220
netcan wrote: post #10

This is (hopefully not) obnoxiously off-topic... As a Hebrew speaker, I wish the "shibboleth" idiom (which is a good one) was translated, rather than transliterated. laoned idioms are inherently exotic, and this one is worth demystifying It means any choice of word (or pronunciation, in the literal example) that clearly identifies the speaker's group affiliations. A good modern example is "LondonDerry/Derry. This'd b…

I feel obligated to say, I THINK YOU'LL FIND THAT'S DERRY/LONDONDERRY, SON.

Is it? I don't think anyone but the city council and BBC use the hyphen.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#227

Post by novok »

loco5niner wrote: post #224
sneak wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it can imply divorce, but it does not specify; it is ambiguous. You are assigning explicit communication where there is none, objectively. The listener's assumptions (or lack thereof), which happen after the speaker speaks, cannot retroactively cause the statement to be or not be a lie.

Please provide an example that is not divorce where this phrase applies.

Someone can have kids without marrying the mother? There are also other edge cases, such as adoption, surrogacy, etc.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#228

Post by TimTheTinker »

fortran77 wrote: post #199
TimTheTinker wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s common usage within the Christian community to refer to it as such. Christianity’s roots are in Judaism - and that fact doesn’t constitute poor taste. So neither does using the Christian term for the Tanakh within a Christian context. Now, knowingly calling it that to a Jew might possibly be interpreted as a form of disrespect, but in my experience most Jews don’t mind at all. It’s a shared scripture, so there’s…

Saying that the bible of a certain religion is obsolete and has been superseded (which is what "old" means in this sense) can't be interpreted kindly to say the least. You have every right to feel that it is obsolete, of course, but you should at least realize that this is not going to be considered well by the people whose holy books you appropriated, modified, and replaced.

> whose holy books you appropriated, modified, and replaced

I don't know what you're referring to - these claims have no basis in reality.

> appropriated

Christianity did not appropriate the Tanakh. The first Christians were actually Jews (and converts to Judaism), and no gentiles even joined them until about 2 years after Christianity began to spread outward from Jerusalem. The most prominent leaders and evangelists in the early church continued to be Jews for many years after Jesus (who was himself a Jew) -- all 12 of the primary apostles, Paul the apostle, James the leader of the church in Jerusalem (who was actually a half-brother of Jesus), etc. All of these Jewish Christian leaders (including Jesus himself) recognized the Tanakh as scripture, so any subsequent gentile converts were assenting to that designation, not appropriating it for themselves. So in terms of descent, Christianity and modern Judaism have a common ancestor, the pre-Talmud Judaism of first-century Israel. You could just as well say that modern Judaism appropriated the Tanakh--and that statement would be just as absurd.

> modified

Christianity has not modified the Tanakh. Our modern translations use the Masoretic Text as their primary source, with insights from the Septuagint, various targums, the dead sea scrolls, and other early sources -- all of which came from pre-Christian Judaism. The MT itself is attested by hundreds of early copies, so our textual criticism allows for very high accuracy, especially when helped by ancient witnesses like the dead sea scrolls. There is absolutely no basis to your claim.

> replaced

Christianity has not replaced the Tanakh. See my other reply to your comment. It is and always will be God's holy word, to all eternity.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#229

Post by sneak »

loco5niner wrote: post #224
sneak wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it can imply divorce, but it does not specify; it is ambiguous. You are assigning explicit communication where there is none, objectively. The listener's assumptions (or lack thereof), which happen after the speaker speaks, cannot retroactively cause the statement to be or not be a lie.

Please provide an example that is not divorce where this phrase applies.

The one in question in this thread is a good example. He spent his weekend with his kids.

Re: Shibboleths that get you past the initial script stage

#230

Post by forgotmypwd123 »

netcan wrote: post #226
forgotmypwd123 wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel obligated to say, I THINK YOU'LL FIND THAT'S DERRY/LONDONDERRY, SON.

Is it? I don't think anyone but the city council and BBC use the hyphen.

Or the civil service. I'm sure there's plenty of dickheads would still want derry put first even when using both, though
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