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Soli

atap.google.com

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Re: Soli

#221

Post by cma »

GistNoesis wrote: post #163

It is a nice piece of technology. It is a 60Ghz millimeter-wave radar. It is a privacy nightmare. It is already shipped. Radar uses electromagnetic waves (like Wifi but higher frequency) so it can go through walls, and even typical range for gesture recognition is less than meter, It probably can go at least 10 times as far by boosting the gain of the amplifier, it is not constrained like a theremin would be because…

Are you sure? 60Ghz is used for low latency video streaming and doesn't penetrate anything.

Re: Soli

#222

Post by markandrewj »

tibbon wrote: post #189
GistNoesis wrote: post #163

It is a nice piece of technology. It is a 60Ghz millimeter-wave radar. It is a privacy nightmare. It is already shipped. Radar uses electromagnetic waves (like Wifi but higher frequency) so it can go through walls, and even typical range for gesture recognition is less than meter, It probably can go at least 10 times as far by boosting the gain of the amplifier, it is not constrained like a theremin would be because…

Time to make a theremin app!

Somewhat ironically, in context of the thread about privacy, the inventor of the theremin is also known for creating this soviet listening device.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thing_(listening_device)

Re: Soli

#223

Post by GistNoesis »

mlyle wrote: post #212
arghwhat wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 60Ghz millimiter-wave radar > so it can go through walls 60 GHz RF doesn't really pass through anything , which is the entire reason that the frequency is used for radar. A radar needs powerful reflections to detect things. Penetration impedes its operation, and would be akin to a camera that is out of focus. I'm also unsure if the resolution of this chip is noteworthy.

Yup, the range claims are silly, too. Radar has an inverse fourth power with distance, so to go 10x as far by adding power, you need 10000x as much power, which is quite a challenge at 60GHz.

You are right that Radar follows an inverse 4th power with distance (inverse 2th power for the light to go to the reflected object then 2th power for the reflected wave to go back to your antenna).

For 3$ https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/32786483344.html a 6Ghz radar that goes 12meters using 30mA, so my range claims are not that silly.

When there is no obstacle 6Ghz or 60Ghz doesn't matter.

Re: Soli

#224

Post by skykooler »

allenu wrote: post #165
spectramax wrote: post #51

Those growing up with Remote Controls of the kind: https://i.imgur.com/AIqz63k.jpg After a few days, the user develops a muscle memory of sorts. User doesn't even have to look at the controller and all actions (and feedback) are executed through the tactile interface. From cockpits to nuclear power plants to home tv remote control, there is absolutely nothing that replaces physical buttons, encoders, sliders and togg…

I have an apple trackpad device (i.e. separate from the laptop) and I believe it uses a fake haptic feedback to indicate a "click" as opposed to a real mechanism. It's indistinguishable from a real click. HOWEVER, it makes my skin crawl when the driver doesn't register my click and there is zero feedback when I press down on it. It's like pressing down on the surface of my desk and it feels absolutely gross. This hap…

The trackpad 1 does indeed have a real click - the way it works is that the little feet that sit on the desk are tactile pushbuttons; clicking moves the entire trackpad while the feet click in. It's disappointing this was removed in the trackpad 2; it's a very satisfying mechanism.

Re: Soli

#225

Post by schmichael »

eutropia wrote: post #178
GistNoesis wrote: post #163

It is a nice piece of technology. It is a 60Ghz millimeter-wave radar. It is a privacy nightmare. It is already shipped. Radar uses electromagnetic waves (like Wifi but higher frequency) so it can go through walls, and even typical range for gesture recognition is less than meter, It probably can go at least 10 times as far by boosting the gain of the amplifier, it is not constrained like a theremin would be because…

> In the case of Pixel 4, the model runs on device, never sends sensor data to Google servers, and helps it interpret the motion to Quick Gestures. From the "Technology" page linked at the top. Personally, I don't see how it is meaningfully any worse for privacy than the always on microphone in the google assistant. And I look forward to what it will enable for VR and AR tech!

"Never sending raw sensor data to Google" and "Never sending inferences made from sensor data to Google" are massively different claims.

"Never sending raw sensor data to Google" is an efficiency claim that means little with regard to protecting privacy.

Re: Soli

#226

Post by drusepth »

Crinus wrote: post #109
Fernicia wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>there is absolutely nothing that replaces physical buttons, encoders, sliders and toggles Even space, versatility, & cost aside, there are definitely tasks that a touch screen does better. Using a map with a touch screen is incredibly intuitive compared to a mouse. (I cannot imagine using sliders or other "physical" interfaces) >A physical button guarantees that the action was performed by the means of feedback So y…

> Using a map with a touch screen is incredibly intuitive compared to a mouse. (I cannot imagine using sliders or other "physical" interfaces) What sort of map use you have in mind? I find panning (drag+move) and zooming (mousewheel) maps with the mouse very intuitive.

One big piece of functionality missing from mouse-controlled maps is rotation. I can't imagine doing it with a mouse, but "grabbing" a map with two fingers and intuitively rotating it to the angle you want is huge.

Similarly, two-finger swipe up/down to adjust viewing angle is something that could technically be done with a slider you drag with a mouse, but I definitely wouldn't call that better.

Re: Soli

#227

Post by jdietrich »

cushychicken wrote: post #206
0xffff2 wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could you expand on the result of said innovation? Where would I see Kinect driven innovation in everyday life?

Much of that technology was improved and miniaturized, and incorporated into the Apple Face ID bar at the top of the iPhone X.

Apple bought PrimeSense (the company behind Kinect) for $360m.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PrimeSense

Re: Soli

#228

Post by tomphoolery »

jasonhong wrote: post #119

I recently showed some videos of Soli in the HCI class I teach. Students immediately hit upon the two major issues I wanted to discuss (I was pretty proud!). The first is learnability. A big problem with gestures is that there is no clear affordance as to what kinds of gestures you can do, or any clear feedback. For feedback, one could couple Soli's input with a visual display, but at that point, it's not clear if th…

> How can the system differentiate if you are intentionally gesturing as input vs incidentally gesturing?

This is why I had to change my Amazon Echo Dot's call word back from "Computer". Turns out one might say "computer" a lot during the course of the day, and Alexa was CONSTANTLY going off when it shouldn't have. It was so disappointing that I gave the echo dot away.

Re: Soli

#229

Post by tomekjapan »

Lots of negativity in the comments here, but I personally will love to have a way of interacting with the phone even when my fingers are wet or dirty.

Re: Soli

#230

Post by yalogin »

Why is this needed? I can see there are some niche needs like when you are cooking and cannot touch the screen. But that is what voice is for. What exactly is soli solving? Looks like over engineering to me, simply because they can.
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