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The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

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Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#221

Post by tw04 »

harryf wrote: post #34
Roritharr wrote: post #9

Google invested Billions into Android. Samsung tried to hedge for this by building Tizen(Bada) and realized how much needed to be invested to get an Android competitor going, so they kept the development going, but focused for their Smartwatches, as this would have to be a "if the worst happens" plan, not something that could be a profitable venture. LG has the Palm/HP borne WebOS for their TVs, i suspect with a simi…

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

Had blackberry made messenger multi-platform 15 years ago, and released an email app for iOS and Android they would still own the business market.

Even in 2019 email sucks on a modern smartphone compared to blackberry in 2004.

I'm still hoping Apple wakes up and releases messenger for Windows and Android before that ship sails. They claim to be a services company but they still can't seem to let go of tying it to devices.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#222

Post by tw04 »

EGreg wrote: post #72
harryf wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

Isn’t Android open source? So why can’t Huawei simply fork it?

Why do you think Google is working on Fuschia? The second a major competitor forks android in any meaningful way, I guarantee they switch to Fushia and stop all further contributions to Android.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#223

Post by bregma »

rickdeckard wrote: post #42
harryf wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s possible that Google cutting off Huawei will actually backfire, because it makes having a viable alternative to Android a MUST HAVE instead of just NICE TO HAVE. Perhaps it’s possible to resurrect Blackberry 10 ( https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BlackBerry_10 ) for example, which seemed to be an impressive piece of engineering that got trampled by Blackberrys failing business. I played with a demo once that could…

BB10 is based on QNX platform, I strongly doubt that QNX is independent from any US assets, patents, licenses, so moving from Android to BB10 is just "more of the same"

QNX developer here. I don't think what you're saying is true. QNX has patents registered in the USA, and in other countries, but that's hardly relevant. It's a Canadian company owned by a Canadian corporation.

BB10, on the other hand, is dead and buried. It would be easier to port something like UBPort's Ubuntu Touch to QNX as an alternative to Android.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#224

Post by derefr »

Roritharr wrote: post #9

Google invested Billions into Android. Samsung tried to hedge for this by building Tizen(Bada) and realized how much needed to be invested to get an Android competitor going, so they kept the development going, but focused for their Smartwatches, as this would have to be a "if the worst happens" plan, not something that could be a profitable venture. LG has the Palm/HP borne WebOS for their TVs, i suspect with a simi…

Isn’t KaiOS [nee FirefoxOS] open-source in a way where any of these companies could just... use it? (In the same way they can “just use” Android now?) Why do they need to make their own?

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#225

Post by seniorivn »

NotPaidToPost wrote: post #86
rickdeckard wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. The situation is much more opening the space for OTHER Chinese vendors to jump in and grab the market. Samsung is already selling in all channels where Huawei is, so they have their shelf-space allocated already. That slot will not remain vacant. LG can surely grab a bit more business in short-term for sales-channels they were not selling to, because even if they are not in a specific channel, they have p…

EE (owned by BT) launched its 5G lineup in London this week. They dropped Huawei but had a OnePlus instead. More Chinese brands pop up every time you try to cut one off ;)

You will be surprised how good it will be for poping up chenese if you cut off ccp and all of it subbrands like huawei and etc

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#226

Post by rchaud »

dindresto wrote: post #70
pas wrote: post #56

“Consumers are attached to the Google products and services that sit on top of the operating system,” I doubt that. Google is pretty bad at keeping users. (Probably GMail is the strongest anchor point, but as we have seen with the G+ real name gotcha, it's better to be prepared to stop using that. Though of course most GMail users are not prepared for that.) Users will use whatever is the default. Probably the YouTub…

I think Windows Phone has shown that "Google/Alphabet/YT would make apps for that platform too" is far from true.

The issue with Windows Phone was that it was a Microsoft venture, and Google was already paying MS around $5 in license fees for every activated Android device [0]. They weren't in any hurry to make WP more competitive by offering a Youtube app. I had a WP device in 2011, and there were third party apps (MetroTube I think) that were like Newpipe in that you could watching and download YT videos for offline viewing. Not surprisingly, Google changed their APIs and broke the download capability.

That said, Google didn't build third-party YT apps for BB10 or WebOS either.

[0] https://www.computerworld.com/article/2475440/microsoft-gets...

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#227

Post by derefr »

kuschku wrote: post #79
EGreg wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t Android open source? So why can’t Huawei simply fork it?

Google has spent the last decade cutting apart the open part of Android and making it more and more proprietary. Launcher, Phone app, Messages, Contacts, Calendar. All proprietary. Notification API, Location API, SMS APIs and step counter APIs, and even the new app format. All proprietary. It's a huge undertaking building an app for Android today without using Google's services, and sometimes even impossible. If you…

So, that “huge undertaking” is exactly what LineageOS is, isn’t it? So couldn’t Huawei fork that?

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#228

Post by bregma »

sbarre wrote: post #140
snaky wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huawei could make their own Play Services, API-compatible with Google, then all apps would work the same. Maybe that's what they actually do now.

As the article says, Amazon spent _years_ trying this approach and ultimately failed with their phone project. So sure it's possible, but it's not as easy as you perhaps think?

Aw c'mon, it's just software.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#229

Post by ttflee »

kuschku wrote: post #79
EGreg wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t Android open source? So why can’t Huawei simply fork it?

Google has spent the last decade cutting apart the open part of Android and making it more and more proprietary. Launcher, Phone app, Messages, Contacts, Calendar. All proprietary. Notification API, Location API, SMS APIs and step counter APIs, and even the new app format. All proprietary. It's a huge undertaking building an app for Android today without using Google's services, and sometimes even impossible. If you…

All 'Android' phones sold in China did not rely a tiny bit of those Google stuff, as Google's existence in China has been negligible since it was blocked.

All major 'Android' manufacturers in China somewhat customized launchers with unique UXs. Notification services were always chaotic and every platform provider woke the phone up to checkout pending notifications and drained the battery. And this list of abyss easily expanded to App Markets and other features.

So blocking Huawei from Android might create some troubles but it would definitely not be around these proprietary features where other proprietary counterparts existed, at least in China, Huawei's home market.

Re: The Huawei Disaster Reveals Google’s Iron Grip on Android

#230

Post by seniorivn »

jklinger410 wrote: post #214
irq-1 wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Phone companies tried to replace the open versions first. Google was faced with either: a different version of Android on each phone (with the apps replaced,) or making their own versions. Note too that they could have gone the Microsoft IE route and declared various apps as part of the OS. Instead they made their apps separate from Android, and let them succeed by bundling them together. Amazon Fire is at least one…

>Fire is at least one example /thread To answer the big question in this thread. Yes, Huawei can simply fork Android. It will be a pain in the ass, expensive, and not as usable, but they certainly can. Google's "iron grip" in this instance is only ostensible, not literal and complete. HN is not immune to clickbait.

They kind of actually already did, like all the chinese companies. Because CCP banned google from chinese market years ago. Banning all CCP related corporations should have been implemented as a part of opening to china. or at least as an answer to CCP's censorship protectionism, etc.
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