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EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

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Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#221

Post by benj111 »

Silhouette wrote: post #197
benj111 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You asked for a part of the agreement. I ventured a somewhat uninformed opinion. If you know more than me, then isn't it incumbent on you to venture an opinion on why we're in the situation of trying to avoid a hard border?

If you know more than me, then isn't it incumbent on you to venture an opinion on why we're in the situation of trying to avoid a hard border? If you're asking for my personal, subjective opinion, then I think it's a combination of two factors. Firstly, there are the local issues. Taken in isolation, avoiding changes that would unnecessarily restrict crossings at the NI/Ireland border is obviously a good thing, parti…

So in your view who are the principle agents pushing for the backstop?

The DUP are pro brexit, but I suppose would like the best of both worlds if they could, but weren't in favour of the proposed backstop.

Teresa May, appears to me to be the principle agent, but while a remainer, seems to be more in favour of keeping her party together, than doing what's best for the country. So I cant really see her going for the backstop, and continuing to defend it without good reason.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#222

Post by hinkley »

hkmurakami wrote: post #143
TorKlingberg wrote: post #22

Japan has avoided the madness of tariffs and trade wars that has affected the west recently. Instead they have been quietly negotiating trade deals with everyone and generally getting along. Good on them! Also it includes cheese, which will make westerners in Japan very happy.

I still remember how horridly expensive cheese was in Japan. This is excellent news.

One of the weird, nearly constant cultural boundaries is fermented foods. I suspect even without the tariffs cheese will still be expensive in Japan.

It doesn't really 'go' with a lot of the cuisine. I mean, if you handed me donburi with cheese in it I'd probably say, "Okay, that's weird but it could work so let me try it," but I'm wracking my brain trying to think what other dishes you could fit in it. Certainly ethnic food from Europe and the Americas, but how else would you go about naturalizing cheese into the diet?

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#223

Post by CodeGlitch »

ionised wrote: post #77
growlist wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'benefitted'

Yes, the UK benefitted greatly from the massive net positive contribtuions that immigration had on its economy.

Except no matter how much we spend on the NHS - it still can't cope. Schools are full, and the transport system struggles everyday (the tube every morning is a miserable experience).

These every-day issues are the things that people are most concerned with.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#224

Post by avar »

cyphar wrote: post #186
roywiggins wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The TPP would have folded in a bunch of environmental protection rules, but the US blew it up. It's debatable how good these protections would have been, but they were not nothing. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Pacific_Partnership#Envi...

The TPP had many other issues though. Examples include criminal penalties for breaking DRM or disclosing trade secrets, and establishing an international tribunal that allows corporations to sue for monetary damages from a government that passes a law which they feel is discriminatory. (I know the US has trade agreements like this already, but it's a new thing for Australia -- and unfortunately we are now part of the…

What's your proposed alternative to this sort of international tribunal? To me it feels like obviously the correct solution, and e.g. the EU/EEA has this with the EFTA courts and the WTO has it with its courts. Point in favor:

1. It makes sense for a corporation in say Malaysia to be able to sue Australia over state subsidies, otherwise they need to convince their own governments to bring it up at the inter-state level, and Malaysia may consider it too small of an issue to piss off Australia

2. There needs to be one centralized enforcing mechanism. A Malaysian company can't sue the Australian government in its own courts (or Australia's), both would have an obvious bias towards their own country.

Even if we assume the courts are fair you'll create N^2 amount of enforcement relationships for the N countries in the deal. That's just redundant, and everyone has an interest in centrally set legal precedent.

3. There need to be damages so countries can't circumvent the trade deal with what amounts to state-sponsored favoritism with impunity.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#225

Post by CodeGlitch »

growlist wrote: post #166
oblio wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't Britain de-industrialize of its own volition, in the 60s/70s/80s? :)

I met a plasterer that told me he'd had to change careers because Polish competition would work for so much less, so it's not as simple as that.

Not sure why you were downvoted. This is a common problem for people "working in the trade".

...and pretty much any low-paid job.

We used to have machines that washed our cars, that's now been replaced by the Polish as they can do it for cheaper (and better).

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#226

Post by nnq »

nnq wrote: post #115
growlist wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So then it IS apparently possible to have a free trade zone without freedom of movement.

...but why would anyone ever want that?! If people are able to move freely, then each country should be able to apply tariffs to extract benefits from the economic gradients. If people can move freely, then that's the ideal. Institutions, governments, "nations" and companies that collapse because of the free movement of people deserve to collapse and should be left to due so. The should even be "helped" to collapse f…

Edit typo 2nd para: "If people are NOT able to..."

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#228

Post by afiori »

avar wrote: post #224
cyphar wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The TPP had many other issues though. Examples include criminal penalties for breaking DRM or disclosing trade secrets, and establishing an international tribunal that allows corporations to sue for monetary damages from a government that passes a law which they feel is discriminatory. (I know the US has trade agreements like this already, but it's a new thing for Australia -- and unfortunately we are now part of the…

What's your proposed alternative to this sort of international tribunal? To me it feels like obviously the correct solution, and e.g. the EU/EEA has this with the EFTA courts and the WTO has it with its courts. Point in favor: 1. It makes sense for a corporation in say Malaysia to be able to sue Australia over state subsidies, otherwise they need to convince their own governments to bring it up at the inter-state lev…

The presence of a central court that can regulate goverment that act rashly is one thing, to allow individual companies to sue governments is another.

Re: EU and Japan create world's biggest free trade zone

#230

Post by athenot »

hinkley wrote: post #222
hkmurakami wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still remember how horridly expensive cheese was in Japan. This is excellent news.

One of the weird, nearly constant cultural boundaries is fermented foods. I suspect even without the tariffs cheese will still be expensive in Japan. It doesn't really 'go' with a lot of the cuisine. I mean, if you handed me donburi with cheese in it I'd probably say, "Okay, that's weird but it could work so let me try it," but I'm wracking my brain trying to think what other dishes you could fit in it. Certainly eth…

Cheese (at least in France) is not a topping but something consumed after the main course (and with bread).

I could see a donbury followed by some mild cheeses.

Perhaps stronger cheeses might even go with bonito flakes or other dried fish products. I'm sure some experimentation in pairing could yield some interesting results.

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