This is why we need self-hosted FOSS alternatives to Patron. There is LiberaPay/GratisPay, but they still rely on payment processing...so need a fully distributed p2p way to earn money, such as via block chain.
An Open Letter to Patreon
221–230 of 245 posts
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
How would you funnel your fans to your own website if the credit card processors won't let YOU sell porn?
Just put a link to your website in your profile. Or in the emails you send out to your patrons periodically.
You didn't understand my point. Having a website isn't enough to sell porn if the credit card companies won't let you charge money for it.
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#223As a white hetro male who consumes porn, as do %90 of us white hetro males do. I do not understand how it can be "fine" and "modern" for us to watch porn. But not "fine" and "modern" for the women who produce it to be paid for it. Porn is one of the few products out there that provides real value, real stress relief, and has no environmental or moral downsides. Porn is better for the environment, animals rights, and,…
Porn is extraordinarily destructive. To say that it has no moral downsides is incredible: https://www.yourbrainonporn.com/
Of course porn addiction is real, but not everyone is addicted to porn. In-fact, the vast majority of porn viewers are not. I'm %100 sure that social media addiction is more prevalent and more destructive to those who have it. When I watch porn, I do so until I reach orgasm, and then I'm satisfied for at least 24 hours. I find hacker news to be FAR FAR more addictive and destructive. Porn helps me sleep, HN is quite the opposite ;).
That multiple potential mates theory is a pretty silly reason to hate on porn. Anyone who lives in a major metro area and rides public transport is absolutely overwhelmed with close contact with beautiful women and I don't see that as being somehow harmful or destructive. By that same logic we should go full on Saudi/ISIS and force everyone to wear hijab!
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#224Earlier quoted context omitted.
> The anti-PC crowd immediately latched onto these few sentences and now HN top upvoted thread is all about how the letter made the HN crowd feel uncomfortable. I'm pro-PC and have routinely come out in defence of the concept here on HN. Last year there was a rash of MRA crap on HN, and I was arguing against it regularly. I also have no problem with porn itself, and view it myself. Now, all this being said, the openi…
You are correct that the article doesn't show it, but claims it. So your point is that you think the claim is wrong? Because, as I've said elsewhere, I think it's prima facie extremely plausible. The idea that minorities are overrepresented amongst the most vulnerable populations, especially when several dimensions of marginalization intersect (in this case adult content creation) is not at all far fetched. Instead i…
It's a bit rich that you require me to provide proof to back up my claims, but are happy to settle for 'plausible' in the article. Why am I held to the stricter standard? How can I disprove something where no solid claims are made in the first place? The article claims that Patreon cutting out that section of their business has made people afraid they're literally going to die as a result, and you think that's extremely plausible?
Only 3 days ago I mentioned I was getting tired of this current fad to dismiss commentary by demanding proof
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15529895
> So your point is that you think the claim is wrong?
In any case, I think there's some truth to what they say, but it's ridiculously overblown (hence "stretching the truth" above). They played the 'social duty to society's vulnerables' pretty hard, and yet plenty of those content creators are not vulnerable. Nor disabled. Nor are PoC. Nor are LGBT. Why do we assume PoC and LGBT are more vulnerable by default here? Where should the line of social responsibility be drawn? Should Patreon be shamed into a business model they don't want because of a single person who fits the 'vulnerable' description? 10 people? 100?
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#225Earlier quoted context omitted.
5% is a pretty small middleman 'take'. I agree with the 'you shouldn't rely on an independent entity you don't have leverage over', but not because they're taking a cut.
last I checked it was 10%. They charge 5% for processing payments which is 2% higher than paypal and stripe charge for processing payments, which they are certainly pocketing as hidden profit. Which is lying, another reason not to work with them. It is _so easy_ to set up a wordpress site and start taking payments using something like wp-invoice or woocommerce. You don't need a fancy custom theme. The built in themes…
Fair enough, I just took it from here, which doesn't list the specific processing fee. https://patreon.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/204606125-How-...
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#226Earlier quoted context omitted.
If being uncomfortable while working was to be made illegal, there'd be few minimum-wage jobs left. From burger-flipping to call centers, people do it because they have to, not because they want to. Coercion is a different kettle of fish, but being uncomfortable at your work is a pretty normal state of being.
We're talking about morality, not laws.
So am I. You didn't seriously think I was suggesting we outlaw minimum wage jobs?
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#227As a white hetro male who consumes porn, as do %90 of us white hetro males do. I do not understand how it can be "fine" and "modern" for us to watch porn. But not "fine" and "modern" for the women who produce it to be paid for it. Porn is one of the few products out there that provides real value, real stress relief, and has no environmental or moral downsides. Porn is better for the environment, animals rights, and,…
Porn is extraordinarily destructive. To say that it has no moral downsides is incredible: https://www.yourbrainonporn.com/
Not sure citing a notoriously unreliable quack site that uses evidence as well as a typical anti-vaxxer page is helping your case here.
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#228Earlier quoted context omitted.
What if Patreon wants to be family friendly, and allowing the selling of porn on Patreon ruins that image? Seems like a business opportunity for another website to take that niche, a "Porntreon" if you will.
Aren't NSFW filters good enough for family friendliness in America? There are, of course, things which are not suitable for children, frightening things, disturbing things, content related to immoral behavior. But if you ask an American, the destruction of life is far more suitable for children than it's creation. Patreon has no qualms hosting videos fantasizing mass murder and death [1] even when those videos are ob…
Yeah, patreon should shut [1] down, because otherwise kids might incorporate the lessons learned and just engage in space battles with their spaceships all willy-nilly.
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#229Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are correct that the article doesn't show it, but claims it. So your point is that you think the claim is wrong? Because, as I've said elsewhere, I think it's prima facie extremely plausible. The idea that minorities are overrepresented amongst the most vulnerable populations, especially when several dimensions of marginalization intersect (in this case adult content creation) is not at all far fetched. Instead i…
It's a bit rich that you require me to provide proof to back up my claims, but are happy to settle for 'plausible' in the article. Why am I held to the stricter standard? How can I disprove something where no solid claims are made in the first place? The article claims that Patreon cutting out that section of their business has made people afraid they're literally going to die as a result, and you think that's extrem…
You complained about their lack of proof first.
I have given arguments [1] why I think their claim is plausible. You haven't given any why you think it's wrong (other than a generic "why should it be true?", which is nothing if not demanding proof from them).
[1] The mentioned communities are overrepresented in any risk category, from drug addiction, to HIV, to homelessness (the sole exception I know of would be suicide). They tend to be more overrepresented when marginalisation dimensioons intersect, as they do here.
Re: An Open Letter to Patreon
#230Earlier quoted context omitted.
Porn is extraordinarily destructive. To say that it has no moral downsides is incredible: https://www.yourbrainonporn.com/
Of course porn addiction is real, but not everyone is addicted to porn. In-fact, the vast majority of porn viewers are not. I'm %100 sure that social media addiction is more prevalent and more destructive to those who have it. When I watch porn, I do so until I reach orgasm, and then I'm satisfied for at least 24 hours. I find hacker news to be FAR FAR more addictive and destructive. Porn helps me sleep, HN is quite…
Just to clarify, I don't mean "close contact" in a lewd or sexualized way.