Live data from Hacker News

A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

theverge.com

221–230 of 464 posts

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#221
post #10

Their point about how other countries will take the US's stance as a cue is somewhat scary. If you try and cross any border it will be relinquishing access to all accounts. I'm assuming email also comes along with 'social media', since communication is by its definition social. So how do you protect yourself? I think just going with "Don't have any social media" isn't a good answer because the relationship that child…

See this -^ ? It's a new pseudonymous account. Unless your social network has some kind of insane policy where they only allow you to have a single identity you can use that kind of feature to compartmentalize your activities. Combine that with a phone that lets you have multiple users where you use one for banal activity which you can then show to Big Brother when he comes knocking. And others for anything important…

Social networks are useless with pseudonimous accounts - unless there is some link between pseudonyms. The social aspect is in building the network, having reputation, maintaining a circle of friends and acquaintances, etc. but you can't build network out of throwaway accounts. Of course, HN is not a social network - it's a news/discussion site. So if you don't care about the reputation - which is not prominent anyway, so there's not much reason to care - you can use throwaways freely. But for most social networking functions it's a no go.

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#222
So, for a casual traveler who may have a phone with conversations peppered with unfavorable political views throughout - what is the best security hygiene in this situation?

Anyone have tips or tricks that average people can use, things that maybe don't involve having a separate phone etc?

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> — Even if something “suspicious” is found, that is not guilt and no charges can be laid so what is the point!? I'm not defending this highly disturbing practice, but the point is that it's a political test. If they find anything politically disturbing on the phone, they can refuse you entry.

> If they find anything politically disturbing on the phone, they can refuse you entry. No they can't. Refusing to allow a US citizen to (ever) re-enter the country isn't allowed. At worst they can detain you.

I am really curious: What is the reasoning to allow this to happen to US citizens?

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Xenophobia != surveillance state or totalitarianism For example japan or poland are fairly xenophobic and isolationist, but they don't practice a surveillance state or ask for your social media accounts at the border. Foreigners are free to enter as long as they don't overstay their welcome. I would say that xenophobia is the natural state of homogeneous populations. Everything different is treated with suspicioun, b…

I am not saying xenophobia inevitably leads to searching phones. But in the US, right now, the justification for the surveillance state is in a big part due to xenophobia and race relations. It is a major factor in the current pathology and we ignore it at our peril.

The law and order type will always find something to increase their powers. You're just trying to fix their current attack vector, which means they'll just use a different scare tomorrow. To have lasting improvements the security apparatus needs to be scaled down.

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#225
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they ask you "is there any hidden data on this device", you would have to respond in the affirmative. Lying to a border guard is a felony, there's no cute technical solution to this. They will, according to their own paperwork, make copies of any data they find interesting for future analysis.

Hmm, what if we keep some encrypted porn in the shell OS? "Yep, there is hidden data. Do I really need to decrypt my special folder because I really wouldn't like to? OK then, the password is.." Disclaimer: this is all being speculative, of course. I'm not suggesting to lie to or misdirect a border guard in a real-life situation.

Good work, you've just confessed to a crime. Importing pornography into the US is illegal.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/us-customs-is-req...

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#226
Obviously appreciating that NASA has some sensitive data but just for a second also try and appreciate how would this play out for someone who works in the financial industry, where unauthorised sharing of sensitive data is not only a breach of contract with your employer/clients but a crime(insider trading) in almost all countries.

Or imagine how the people who enforce these new regulations can exploit this.

Query from the traveller at the border what their job is, if in the financial industry request that they relinquish their email find something that could tip you off and go buy stock. If they don't you lose nothing, you deport them, you do your job.

I understand that you might want to tear this apart, but keep in mind the person that requests your data will often not be the person viewing it, so you are in no position to just "Take some names" and then ensure that your data remains confidential.

This is terrifying.

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#227
post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Within Europe (ps: as a European citizen) you can go anywhere with a personal identification card (no passport) and there are no border controls (when walking or driving). There isn't even a border, just a sign: welcome to $country (ps: and maybe local driving instructions). Say what you will about the EU, but this has been a great achievement. I can go through airport security between two EU countries and security w…

Within the states of US you can do the same ;) EU essentially wants to be United States of Europe. Though I'm not sure all EU states yet ready to surrender as much national sovereignty as US states did. And what anything of this has to do with homophobia?

Donald Trump is undoubtedly homophobic, I think he's just pointing out that for the country to be voting for him, to an extent a proportion of them must agree.

And I disagree about you saying the EU just wishes to become the United States of Europe. In almost no sense does anyone give up their "sovereignty" by joining the EU. Every country still creates it's own laws, governs how it wishes to and has full control over what happens to itself. The EU only allows free travel and trade between each of the countries within it and also a standard currency and standard regulations (to enable the free travel and trade to happen in a safe environment).

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just don't give them any passwords or unlock anything if you are a US citizen. Let them try to detain a US citizen indefinitely for it.

Exactly. It's your constitutional right as a US citizen to tell any Law Enforcement agent to go fuck themselves. 1. They need a warrant to search your phone if you don't voluntary give them access. 2. Even if they have a warrant, you can plead 5th and just not give them the pin. The American way is all about not trusting the government, believing in conspiracy theories, and stocking up on ammo.

[deleted]

Re: A US-born NASA scientist was detained at the border until he unlocked his phone

#230
post #10

Their point about how other countries will take the US's stance as a cue is somewhat scary. If you try and cross any border it will be relinquishing access to all accounts. I'm assuming email also comes along with 'social media', since communication is by its definition social. So how do you protect yourself? I think just going with "Don't have any social media" isn't a good answer because the relationship that child…

>> Their point about how other countries will take the US's stance as a cue is somewhat scary. I don't see this happening, in Europe at least. It seems like a clear violation of the right to freedom of expression and right to family and private life so shouldn't be possible for any of the 47 members of the Council of Europe (who are bound by the ECHR).

[deleted]
Post reply on HN