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H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

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Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#221
Long time reader, first time poster. Both lawmakers being Califoria democrats, I don't trust this one bit. Hear me out on this one. I have actually experienced the H1B system on my own hide.

As others have mentioned in the comments, today H1B is basically indentured servitude visa. While theoretically you can move to another job, few people dare, especially if they have families, because in case of any screwup whatsoever, you have to leave the country within 2 weeks. That's _insane_. When I was H1-B I chose to wait until I got the green card before making any moves. That took 8 years, during which I did not quite made the kind of career progress I was hoping for. Now that I'm not an H1B, _magically_ I have no problems whatsoever with advancing my career. What a bizarre coincidence.

And I'm not Asian, for Asians it takes longer than that. Another type of abuse you often see (and that was the case with me) is companies hire a very experienced worker in a much lower level position than he ought to be in, considering the experience, and then keep them there until they either work up the courage to move, or get the green card.

The _real_ fix for this should be two fold:

1. Allow H1Bs to move more freely between jobs. If you're a programmer, you should be able to move into e.g. DevOps or Data Science, or DB administration without risking that some bureaucrat decides that's not an eligible transition.

2. Allow more time for them to do so, so they don't have to find another job before leaving their current one. Six months to a year ought to be enough. Implement a cliff of e.g. 1 year to make this more fair to employers if need be, but don't kick families out of the country in 2 weeks just because the breadwinner can't tolerate the abuse anymore.

This will make the market for H1B workers price-competitive with native workers (since they will be able to command market rates given their levels of experience), and DRAMATICALLY reduce abuse. That's literally all that needs to be done. This will also make it easier for people just out of school to get well paid jobs that would today be taken by overqualified and underpaid H1Bs, because the employer will not be able to exploit their ignorance of the job market for long.

Instead they are proposing some tactical bullshit that will only get in the way of a more comprehensive reform that the Trump administration might (or might not, the election is over) come up with.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#222
I was a full time H1B employee at AMEX for 3 years. Its not only the Indian outsourcing firms who abuse the H1B visa system. All American companies including AMEX also do that. The company never even had plans to give me a promotion, not even increase my salary a bit even though I worked hard than the Americans for 3 years !. They pretty well knew I was an indentured servant and paid me 79K/annum. All salary raises and promotions were going to a handful of lazy Americans who rolls into the office whenever they wish. They will never bother to fix bugs or do production releases( because for them, its not cool, we do only cool stuff like React,Angular 2, nodejs & docker. Customer escalated bugs are not cool, let an H1B slave do it).

Anyways, now I am an ex-H1B, I left US and currently residing in Canada with my permanent residence process well on track. I will get PR within 1+ years. No one is going to abuse my status in Canada. I am totally free to work anywhere for anyone. The feeling of freedom when I left US is so gratifying.

My PR process is not tied to my employer, its in my control and Canada's express entry system gives importance to my skills than my luck as in H1B. Its a good thing that the minimum wages are being raised, it will control the abuse to some levels,like they did to me, but then there is a problem of jobs being fully outsourced.

Why should I bother now. Its all behind me. US and its broken H1B immigration system ! Downvote all you want. I am happy, I broke out this modern slavery system.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds awesome considering those body shops use up most of the H-1B quota and significantly underpay their employees compared to industry wages. For example, somewhere between 47% and 85% of H-1Bs are being significantly underpaid compared to their peers, evidence that the program is not being used to bring over workers with "specialized knowledge" as they claim--but to drive down wages. It makes sense though, when y…

> the program is not being used to bring over workers with "specialized knowledge" as they claim--but to drive down wages. While that might or might not be the intent, it seems like a pretty likely effect, right? Just based on the additional supply alone? I wonder about the effect of cutting back H1-B visas too much. If it made salaries rise significantly, wouldn't it upset the social hierarchy of these businesses? S…

Depends on how the execs' compensation is structured. After a certain level they get paid more in stock than in cash. This should, theoretically, incentivize them to succeed. Many devs, outside of the startup scene, are not paid in stock. They get a working wage. If their commitment causes the companies stock to increase by 20%, they will likely not see a 20% bump in pay the next salary go round.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#225
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"if the salary isn't really high..." How high? Why is 100k a magic number? 100k isn't even a big deal in SF or NYC. While a high skilled scientist working in say, Corning, NY at Corning Corp or Niskayuna, NY at GE's research labs, 100k enables a king's life. How would you adjust for experience? Perhaps a company sees immense potential and cultural fit in an employee and wants to groom them for future roles? The wages…

This is goes back to a more philosophical question. Is it fair that some get payed more than others even though they are equally skilled or maybe even contribute more to society? How do you even define being skilled? Politicians only want to allow high skilled immigration, since low skilled immigration takes away jobs or at least constituents seem to think so. For the purpose of a green card application you actually…

> If you define it based on salary you exclude people who are skilled but in locations, industries or professions that don't pay well, say barbers or teachers as an extreme example. Is that fair? I don't know.

Shouldn't this be first class evidence that there is no shortage of barbers or teachers? If there were a shortage then you would pay them more.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#226

On one talks about the actual issue with the H1B. I'm a H1B holder from India, living and working in USA for past 10 years. The actual incentive for companies is that, an H1B holder from India has less rights, they cannot change job or even travel freely outside USA (for decades). That gives the employers full control of the employee. Any guess why companies only recruit from India and China? Because, the country bas…

> they cannot change job Correction: You can change jobs, but the green card process needs to start again but you keep your priority date. EDIT: You can change jobs to another "similar" position i.e. the job responsibilities should be similar. You can't move from an individual contributer to a manager position for example. In this case, the green card application will have to be done again. > That gives the employers…

have you ever thought about yourself as a "risk taker", about getting a greencard ? in 70 years ? Maybe you might have already got it through the L1A loophole fake experience method or future GC abuse method. Do not measure everyone else with the same cup.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#227
post #190
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As ex-cognizant employee, I completely agree. My 4yr with them in India is absolute worst career decision. Manager(s) did treat fellow employee as slave. If you think yourself as a person with some kind of self-respect , I bet you will never grow up on career. Their managers want shoe-lickers not talents. Since the work is mostly junk, even school student can do them after few months of training. Ive seen these outso…

Exactly this. The nepotism, the inability to get promoted because you are not a relative or someone, the people who work with management getting all the credit as you said, its all just disgusting. I can't believe Cognizant is as huge a company as it is. They should never have been able to get the size they are.

>They should never have been able to get the size they are.

May be thats because no one really speaks about dark-side of Indian body-shops. Students are attracted by (initial) high-pay and on-site chances etc. It will take at-least 3 or 4 years to realize the mistake of joining outsourced services industry. By then its too late to leave the company - because all these years they execute some batch jobs and worked in excel sheets.

Only option is either completely quit IT & do some other business or go for higher-studies & hope for better future. I assume less than 1% may quit, 10-20% will give high-studies a try while rest of them stuck due to lack of courage or/and personal/family commitments.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#228

Isn't it a HUGE problem that it's not discriminated by cities according to its living costs? I'm not an expert in macroeconomic policy but I guess it wouldn't be so hard ad doing the discrimination for say the minimum salary, as business owners/shareholders tend to have a better understanding of the concept of the price index than minimum salary earners. And I'm saying this because tech companies in the Bay Area won'…

It is discriminated by city. Prevailing wage for the labour certification is a function of location, position, and level. I am assuming the article is just talking about raising the bottom end of the scale, but can't be sure - it is certainly light on details.

Re: H-1B Visas: U.S. Lawmaker Re-Introduces Bill to Tighten Rules

#229
I don't think this bill would solve or fix anything. If anything it makes really hard for companies far from cities to find workforce. 100K base salary is very less in bay area and in most cities, so it's not hard for these companies to hire H1B workers.

Think about companies that are far from any cities, they may not find lot of developers and they can't even hire H1B workers unless they pay 100K, why may be a lot more than average labor wages. So, it would be more expensive for businesses.

The same would be the case for proposed bill to introduce bidding system. It just gets expensive for the businesses far from cities.

Removing the country quotas for the green cards is the fix needed. People are tied to the employer now waiting years working low wages. Remove the country quotas or at least give EAD - that encourages people to move if an employer pays low salary.

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