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Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

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Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#221

Post by briandear »

actsasbuffoon wrote: post #47
sp332 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really pushing the boundaries of the CAN-SPAM act. You're not allowed to send unsolicited emails. You shouldn't be allowed to pretend that visiting a site is a solicitation. Edit: I misunderstood the mechanism of collecting the addresses. This isn't skirting "unsolicited mail", but it is circumventing the ban on harvested email addresses.

California and New Jersey have laws that go above and beyond the protections outlined in CAN-SPAM. I used to work for a company that sent spam (I swear, I didn't know until after I'd already accepted the job), and we avoided sending to those states. If more states would adopt laws like this, we could dramatically curtail spam. As for what constitutes solicitation, I wish it was that simple. In some instances, compani…

State specific spam laws wouldn't matter unless the company has a physical nexus within that state. You'd have offshore subsidiaries doing the sending even if all 50 states passed such laws.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#222

Post by wtbob »

jamiesonbecker wrote: post #23
sp332 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really pushing the boundaries of the CAN-SPAM act. You're not allowed to send unsolicited emails. You shouldn't be allowed to pretend that visiting a site is a solicitation. Edit: I misunderstood the mechanism of collecting the addresses. This isn't skirting "unsolicited mail", but it is circumventing the ban on harvested email addresses.

> You're not allowed to send unsolicited emails. Actually, you ARE allowed to send unsolicited email, even commercial (UCE). It has to be clearly labeled, contain the postal address of the sender, and contain unsubscribe links. Also, CAN-SPAM only applies to senders in the U.S. (unfortunately). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003#Applicabi...

> Also, CAN-SPAM only applies to senders in the U.S. (unfortunately).

We could always send gunboats to reduce cities whose citizens send unsolicited emails to the U.S. … /s

More seriously, this does seem like the sort of thing which could be addressed through bilateral or multilateral negotiations, including between the private firms who own the international Internet connexions.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#223

Post by Bartweiss »

duhast wrote: post #213
techsupporter wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with the + notation is twofold: First, not all places accept the + character; second, you've now revealed your actual e-mail address (since foobar@gmail.com is just as valid as foobar+dontspamme@gmail.com). I use a subdomain with catch-all, like me.example.com. Everybody is fine with subdomains and then I can use companyname@me.example.com. Using that format doesn't expose my actual e-mail address and mak…

You can use dot as well: foobar.dontspamme@gmail.com

Can you? I believe gmail strips out periods, but doesn't discard content after them like it does with +.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#224

Post by pc86 »

arm wrote: post #174
hoorayimhelping wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're not allowed to send unsolicited emails. Sorry, this is completely false information that is easily verifiable by looking at the wikipedia page for the can spam act: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CAN-SPAM_Act_of_2003#Sending_b... > But when sending unsolicited commercial emails, it must be stated that the email is an advertisement or a marketing solicitation.

Sorry, this is completely correct information if you don’t assume that the US in the only country in the world. For example, Canada’s Bill C-28¹ explicitly prohibits it. ―――――― ¹ — http://www.ctvnews.ca/sci-tech/canada-s-new-anti-spam-law-ap...

> if you don’t assume that the US in the only country in the world.

The US is the only country with a CAN-SPAM Act. Unless Canada has one of those too?

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#225

Post by pc86 »

actsasbuffoon wrote: post #47
sp332 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is really pushing the boundaries of the CAN-SPAM act. You're not allowed to send unsolicited emails. You shouldn't be allowed to pretend that visiting a site is a solicitation. Edit: I misunderstood the mechanism of collecting the addresses. This isn't skirting "unsolicited mail", but it is circumventing the ban on harvested email addresses.

California and New Jersey have laws that go above and beyond the protections outlined in CAN-SPAM. I used to work for a company that sent spam (I swear, I didn't know until after I'd already accepted the job), and we avoided sending to those states. If more states would adopt laws like this, we could dramatically curtail spam. As for what constitutes solicitation, I wish it was that simple. In some instances, compani…

Is a company in New York bound by the laws of New Jersey or California? Do consumer protections for an individual in California extend to every company in the US?

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#226

Post by DoubleGlazing »

My wife's cousin had something like this happen to her two years ago when she was planning her wedding.

She browsed a few specialist wedding sites for inspiration and when she went to to some well known retail sites to start pricing things they seemed to know she was getting married and promoted wedding goods and services on their front page to her.

It freaked her out no end. I suggested a few plugins that seemed to put a stop to it. But a few weeks later she did start getting wedding related snail mail spam.

Its very creepy, especially after the whole Target teenage pregnancy thing.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#227

Post by actsasbuffoon »

pc86 wrote: post #225
actsasbuffoon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

California and New Jersey have laws that go above and beyond the protections outlined in CAN-SPAM. I used to work for a company that sent spam (I swear, I didn't know until after I'd already accepted the job), and we avoided sending to those states. If more states would adopt laws like this, we could dramatically curtail spam. As for what constitutes solicitation, I wish it was that simple. In some instances, compani…

Is a company in New York bound by the laws of New Jersey or California? Do consumer protections for an individual in California extend to every company in the US?

Yes, you can be sued by a California resident for violating California's spam laws even if you're based in another state.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#228

Post by actsasbuffoon »

briandear wrote: post #221
actsasbuffoon wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

California and New Jersey have laws that go above and beyond the protections outlined in CAN-SPAM. I used to work for a company that sent spam (I swear, I didn't know until after I'd already accepted the job), and we avoided sending to those states. If more states would adopt laws like this, we could dramatically curtail spam. As for what constitutes solicitation, I wish it was that simple. In some instances, compani…

State specific spam laws wouldn't matter unless the company has a physical nexus within that state. You'd have offshore subsidiaries doing the sending even if all 50 states passed such laws.

This is incorrect. You may read the actual law here: http://www.spamlaws.com/state/ca.shtml

> § 17529.2. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a person or entity may not do any of the following:

> (a) Initiate or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement from California or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement sent from California.

> (b) Initiate or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement to a California electronic mail address, or advertise in an unsolicited commercial e-mail advertisement sent to a California electronic mail address.

> (c) The provisions of this section are severable. If any provision of this section or its application is held invalid, that invalidity shall not affect any other provision or application that can be given effect without the invalid provision or application.

tl;dr You may not send unsolicited commercial email to California residents. You are also barred from sending unsolicited commercial email from within the state of California, but this is independent of the first part.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#229

Post by perlgeek »

kazinator wrote: post #17

I wrote myself a web application called Tamarind that runs on my web server for managing throwaway mail aliases. "Tamarind" == "Throw-Away Mail Alias Randomization Is Not Defeatable" :) http://www.kylheku.com/cgit/tamarind/tree/README I log in with my IMAP4 user name and password, and then get a simple UI with a table of my aliases, and attached memo strings (which can contain URL's that get converted to links). I ca…

A public (which also means: no logins) service that offers similar one-time email addresses is http://wasteland.rfc822.org/

You can use any word @wasteland.rfc822.org as a an email address, and then look into the inbox of the same name, without any password. I tend to use it for services that want my email address, but from which I don't want any emails, and don't want to maintain permanent accounts with.

Looking at a mostly random example, http://wasteland.rfc822.org/cgi-bin/inbox?inbox=foo it seems to have received about 20 spam mails and one or at most two legitimate signup mails.

Re: Browsing your website does not mean I want your spam

#230

Post by lunchables »

wpietri wrote: post #172
akg_67 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think the proactive customer outreach is "not respecting you"? I view it as providing high level of customer service, before and after sales, in B2B space. It is no different than Amazon displaying related products that you might be interested in or Netflix showing you a queue based on your past viewings, in consumer space. For example, if a visitor's company produces widgets and as a vendor we have previo…

The part I find deeply disrespectful, even more than the hella creepy privacy violations, is your notion that I'm incompetent to decide for myself who I need to talk to. It's not like your web site is hiding the phone number or lacking in other ways for me to contact you. If I look at your website and don't use them, I have decided not to talk to you. It's essentially disrespectful for you to say "Oh, you poor fool,…

Perfectly said. Thank you!
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