Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect • Hacker News Board

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#221

Post by dang » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 10:16 PM UTC

0xFFC wrote: post #180

calibraxis wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If EU were decent, they'd delist Erdogan's enemy the PKK from the terrorist list. The PKK could teach the EU how to improve European society: ( http://edition.cnn.com/2016/03/30/opinions/rojava-kurds-syri... ) Not to mention the PKK would obviously help end ISIS.

This is pure nonsense. Are you kidding me ? do you have any idea what you are talking about ? Even Iraqi Kurds trying to ban PKK because they know what's going on in that organization. Even Kurds in turkey are not happy with PKK. They want a reform , but most of them wants stay in turkey, while the "being Turkish citizen definition changed".Look at how popular HDP is in Kurdish areas in Turkey. You have no clue what…

This comment, and others that you've posted (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399333) break the HN guidelines badly by calling names and being personally rude. We ban accounts that do those things, so please don't do them. In particular, please edit phrases like the following out of your posts to HN:

  This is pure nonsense.

  Are you kidding me?

  do you have any idea what you are talking about?

  You have no clue what are you talking about. 
 
  wasting people times in HN

Notice how much more substantive your current comment becomes if you take out all these rude bits? That's what we're going for here.

Hard politics isn't a great fit for HN to begin with, but if you're going to contribute to such discussions as inevitably arise, it's important to follow these rules—particularly when others are being wrong and provocative.

(None of this is a comment on your politics, only on how you're presenting them. The same applies to all HN users.)

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#222

Post by dang » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 10:19 PM UTC

calibraxis wrote: post #190

0xFFC wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is pure nonsense. Are you kidding me ? do you have any idea what you are talking about ? Even Iraqi Kurds trying to ban PKK because they know what's going on in that organization. Even Kurds in turkey are not happy with PKK. They want a reform , but most of them wants stay in turkey, while the "being Turkish citizen definition changed".Look at how popular HDP is in Kurdish areas in Turkey. You have no clue what…

Rather than mislead everyone, why not quote what exactly you disagree with, and offer evidence? - "How could Isis be eliminated? In the region, everyone knows. All it would really take would be to unleash the largely Kurdish forces of the YPG (Democratic Union party) in Syria, and PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ party) guerillas in Iraq and Turkey. These are, currently, the main forces actually fighting Isis on the ground. T…

> Rather than mislead everyone

That's a form of personal attack which is inevitably provocative of a much worse thread. Please edit such rudeness out of your posts here. Your question would have been fine, and less self-undermining, had you done so.

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#223

Post by nl » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 10:26 PM UTC

studentrob wrote: post #176

nl wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably worth noting that I don't think @gkya is supporting Erdogan. He is merely pointing out that his actions in attempting to censor foreign media have motives which aren't obvious. When one looks at his actions in the light of those motives his actions make a lot of sense. Without those motives his actions appear stupid.

> It's probably worth noting that I don't think @gkya is supporting Erdogan Thanks, I see that now. Some of @gkya's words sounded like they take the opposite viewpoint, such as, >> Speech should not be regulated in any ways >> Freedom of speech does not mean irresponsible and banale flow of whatever one thinks. >> freedom of speech must not mean that one can be reckless, inconsiderate and demeaning. It reads like it…

>> When one looks at his actions in the light of those motives his actions make a lot of sense. Without those motives his actions appear stupid.

> I disagree, see my comments about astute businessmen not using yes-men above. No worries if we don't agree here. Countries are most certainly businesses. They're in the business of acquiring people who generate money.

Right, but that is assuming that Erdogan is trying to do what is best for the country in the long term. Many would argue his primary concern is Erdogan's interests in the short term.

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#224

Post by 0xFFC » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 10:31 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #221

0xFFC wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is pure nonsense. Are you kidding me ? do you have any idea what you are talking about ? Even Iraqi Kurds trying to ban PKK because they know what's going on in that organization. Even Kurds in turkey are not happy with PKK. They want a reform , but most of them wants stay in turkey, while the "being Turkish citizen definition changed".Look at how popular HDP is in Kurdish areas in Turkey. You have no clue what…

This comment, and others that you've posted (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11399333 ) break the HN guidelines badly by calling names and being personally rude. We ban accounts that do those things, so please don't do them. In particular, please edit phrases like the following out of your posts to HN: This is pure nonsense. Are you kidding me? do you have any idea what you are talking about? You have no cl…

Thanks for notifying, but I don't have editing option on those comment. I would be glad to edit them but I don't have option to do (I don't know why).

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#225

Post by calibraxis » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 11:01 PM UTC

0xFFC wrote: post #216

calibraxis wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Irony: I recall your recent post telling everyone to read Chomsky. He recommends supporting and de-listing PKK too! ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vbkqk5WLbLs )

It is fascinating you didn't watch your link at all. The big irony is here , how much people can be stupid and naive. My claim wasn't against Chomsky , It is quite opposite , Chomsky is completely right, But you don't know what you are talking about, Chomsky does not support PKK as he multiple times stated PKK have done seriously bad things. but at the other hand Turkish government have done so many bad things too, t…

Nice that you skipped past where Chomsky explicitly recommends we "support" PKK (and incidentally is for delisting):

Chomsky: They’re killing Yazidis. So what do you do? You support the people who are saving the Yazidis. Who happen to be on the US terrorist list.

Hasan: The PKK.

Chomsky: Yes. They are the ones who are primarily responsible for saving the Yazidis.

Hasan: If the Americans say, "We will drop bombs, and they have been working with various Kurdish groups." Do you support that? I’m just wondering. You, as a critic, do you support that?

Chomsky: Support working with the Kurds? Yeah.

[...]

Chomsky: To the extent that they are supporting the Kurds in Rojava, as they call it, so the Kurdish area of Syria, have defended their territory, seem to be developing, as well as you can under these conditions, a fairly decent society, very different from anything else in Syria, they certainly merit support.

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#226

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 11:07 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #222

calibraxis wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than mislead everyone, why not quote what exactly you disagree with, and offer evidence? - "How could Isis be eliminated? In the region, everyone knows. All it would really take would be to unleash the largely Kurdish forces of the YPG (Democratic Union party) in Syria, and PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ party) guerillas in Iraq and Turkey. These are, currently, the main forces actually fighting Isis on the ground. T…

> Rather than mislead everyone That's a form of personal attack which is inevitably provocative of a much worse thread. Please edit such rudeness out of your posts here. Your question would have been fine, and less self-undermining, had you done so.

[deleted]

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#227

Post by stale2002 » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 11:18 PM UTC

gkya wrote: post #185

stale2002 wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"One cannot say anything and go by." Yes you CAN. Nobody has a right not to be offended. You don't have to be mindful of what you say. That's not freedom of speech.

You have to be mindful of what you say, that is, you mustn't say things you can't prove. You mustn't lie. Or else, you'll be disproved, and announced publicly as a liar. I don't say that you are not free to lie, though, what I say is, in this case, by lying, you accept such consequences. By saying something, you're responsible to its truth. You're free to insult, but you don't have to. If you do so, people will get o…

You can't go around talking about how people are "free to insult" but that other people have a right not to be insulted. That is BS double speak.

Either you believe in free speech or you don't. Don't pussy foot around it.

If you believe that people should be arrested for insulting people in the wrong way then SAY it! Dont hide behind some human dignity double speak.

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#228

Post by jakub_h » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 11:45 PM UTC

return0 wrote: post #206

jakub_h wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "descends from a multicultural, religiously tolerant empire (Ottoman)" Where the terms "multicultural" and "religiously tolerant" apparently mean something quite a bit different from today (just like Athenian democracy from ours, for example).

I don't think they are that different. Even romans had multiculturalism. Tolerance was not invented in the modern West.

Well, Romans, from what I can tell, had better multiculturalism than Ottomans centuries later. They did not split the society into religion-based classes. So "the West" was quite a bit more progressive centuries earlier in some ways.

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#229

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Mar 31, 2016, 11:51 PM UTC

dang wrote: post #222

calibraxis wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than mislead everyone, why not quote what exactly you disagree with, and offer evidence? - "How could Isis be eliminated? In the region, everyone knows. All it would really take would be to unleash the largely Kurdish forces of the YPG (Democratic Union party) in Syria, and PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ party) guerillas in Iraq and Turkey. These are, currently, the main forces actually fighting Isis on the ground. T…

> Rather than mislead everyone That's a form of personal attack which is inevitably provocative of a much worse thread. Please edit such rudeness out of your posts here. Your question would have been fine, and less self-undermining, had you done so.

[deleted]

Re: Erdogan’s Attempt to Suppress German Satire Has the Opposite Effect

#230

Post by calibraxis » Fri, Apr 01, 2016, 12:04 AM UTC

dang wrote: post #222

calibraxis wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than mislead everyone, why not quote what exactly you disagree with, and offer evidence? - "How could Isis be eliminated? In the region, everyone knows. All it would really take would be to unleash the largely Kurdish forces of the YPG (Democratic Union party) in Syria, and PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ party) guerillas in Iraq and Turkey. These are, currently, the main forces actually fighting Isis on the ground. T…

> Rather than mislead everyone That's a form of personal attack which is inevitably provocative of a much worse thread. Please edit such rudeness out of your posts here. Your question would have been fine, and less self-undermining, had you done so.

When faced with abusers [1], it may be mentally healthiest to briefly indulge in slightly-unpleasant words like: "Rather than mislead everyone..."

Why? Abuse stays with people during the day, and it is better to ever-so-slightly reflect it back on the abuser, than for it to come out on your employees (or friends, children, dog...)

[1] "You have no clue what are you talking about", "how much people can be stupid and naive", etc.