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What I use instead of Google services

gabrielweinberg.com

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Re: What I use instead of Google services

#211

Post by harry8 »

nickonline wrote: post #189
dirtyaura wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? Of 12-14 services he listed, 4 were from Apple (iOS, Mobile Safari, Apple Maps for directions, and iCloud for Calendar sync). And quite likely, he is not paranoidily avoiding Google, but partly experimenting as he is running one of the very few companies that are directly trying to compete with Google in search.

Just going from your examples above: - Safari/iOS will let Apple know you're in a market for a house - Safari will let Apple know you like Ethiopain coffee - Also it will probably allow them to track your searches - Along with Calendar sync and maps Apple knows both where you are currently and where you'll be next While not all of his eggs are in one basket, there's an awful lot of them providing an awful lot of "tra…

Hang on, safari/ios report back to apple your entire search and browse history? Really? I'm genuinely asking here.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#213

Post by yuhong »

zmmmmm wrote: post #188
GhotiFish wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Truthfully. I would have no problem with the amount of data google aggregated on me, if I could depend on them not using that data against me, or to manipulate me, or to sell it to someone who would do either of those two. If someone came up to me and said "I'll give you 5 dollars if you give me the names, email addresses, phone numbers, and personal vulnerabilities of all your friends", agreeing to that would be con…

> do you trust google Ironically, exactly because of the intense scrutiny they face with every small decision they make, I have a lot more faith in Google's inability to be evil than just about any other player. I certainly can't spend the time to verify that all the other players I might give my data to are honest and well intentioned will always stay that way. But at least with Google I have pretty good faith that…

As I said before, Google is not perfect, but I never paid much attention to things like Scroogled.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#214

Post by seanflyon »

imgabe wrote: post #193
seanflyon wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It mitigates the risk. Someone cannot do bad things with your location information if they do not have your location information.

I think it is naive to think that a bad actor who intends you harm will be stopped or even slowed down by the fact that there isn't a log of every location you've visited.

I think that that is a ridiculous statement. Of course giving a bad actor more opportunity to act badly increases the risk.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#215

Post by skierscott »

astrocat wrote: post #75

> "Like most people, I don't like to be tracked. I also am the founder of the search engine that doesn't track you, DuckDuckGo." It pains me to hear intelligent people talk about being "tracked" as something "bad" a priori. While there are certainly plenty of examples of abuse of knowledge, I tend to think of most "tracking" not as "stalking" but as "relationship building." Let me explain... Google is a service provi…

> I tend to think of most "tracking" not as "stalking" but as "relationship building."

I'm fine with relationship building. Google can give me better search results based on other activity they observe; I'm perfectly fine with that. They're simply trying to better their product for the user.

What I'm not fine with is the fact that Google is an advertising company. We're not the end-users, we're the product. Intuition says Google is selling the valuable information they collect to third-party advertisers. This means that our valuable information is being leaked to third parties I'm not sure I can trust.

At the core of it, I only want to give my information out to parties I trust. I don't care if it's valuable information or not, I just want to be in control. I don't want my info being sold to some advertising company -- after all, I'll only buy their product after I build a relationship with Google and they can provide the most relevant links.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#216

Post by spot »

skierscott wrote: post #215
astrocat wrote: post #75

> "Like most people, I don't like to be tracked. I also am the founder of the search engine that doesn't track you, DuckDuckGo." It pains me to hear intelligent people talk about being "tracked" as something "bad" a priori. While there are certainly plenty of examples of abuse of knowledge, I tend to think of most "tracking" not as "stalking" but as "relationship building." Let me explain... Google is a service provi…

> I tend to think of most "tracking" not as "stalking" but as "relationship building." I'm fine with relationship building. Google can give me better search results based on other activity they observe; I'm perfectly fine with that. They're simply trying to better their product for the user. What I'm not fine with is the fact that Google is an advertising company. We're not the end-users, we're the product. Intuition…

> Intuition says Google is selling the valuable information they collect to third-party advertisers.

In this case your intuition has failed you.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#217

Post by astrocat »

eevilspock wrote: post #192
astrocat wrote: post #75

> "Like most people, I don't like to be tracked. I also am the founder of the search engine that doesn't track you, DuckDuckGo." It pains me to hear intelligent people talk about being "tracked" as something "bad" a priori. While there are certainly plenty of examples of abuse of knowledge, I tend to think of most "tracking" not as "stalking" but as "relationship building." Let me explain... Google is a service provi…

> The REAL issue is accountability. True information lockdown rarely benefits anyone, but openness without accountability is useless and downright dangerous. Google is accountable. The problem is that they are accountable to advertisers, currently to the tune of about $55 billion per year. For consumers to hold Google accountable, they have to fight against their addiction to free web content and services, and start…

> The best way to do that is to advocate against ad-supported websites and services, and to advocate (and invent if missing) honest ways to get necessary revenue

I like this. I mean, not gonna lie I love free stuff as much as the next guy but most services that offer to remove ads for a subscription (Spotify/Pandora for example) I pay for.

Even journalism - support your local NPR!

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#218

Post by rtpg »

marrone12 wrote: post #205
nickonline wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just going from your examples above: - Safari/iOS will let Apple know you're in a market for a house - Safari will let Apple know you like Ethiopain coffee - Also it will probably allow them to track your searches - Along with Calendar sync and maps Apple knows both where you are currently and where you'll be next While not all of his eggs are in one basket, there's an awful lot of them providing an awful lot of "tra…

The only difference is that Apple is not an advertising company. Google explicitly uses your information to advertise against you. Apple is not yet in that vertical.

since when is advertising strictly an adversarial arrangement?

Websites such as real estate websites are basically just ads, yet it still offers a service (namely discovery). trailers for movies are also ads but I still like watching them.

There's a lot of disgusting/misleading behaviour in advertising, but it's not strictly an Us vs. Them proposition.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#219

Post by imgabe »

seanflyon wrote: post #214
imgabe wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is naive to think that a bad actor who intends you harm will be stopped or even slowed down by the fact that there isn't a log of every location you've visited.

I think that that is a ridiculous statement. Of course giving a bad actor more opportunity to act badly increases the risk.

A threat to your safety or your freedom needs to be dealt with directly by eliminating it, not hiding from it. If you're envisioning a bad actor with the resources to compile and analyze a comprehensive log of your location, the simple fact that you use service A instead of service B is not going to do a thing to stop them if they're out to get you. You have far bigger problems on your hands.

Re: What I use instead of Google services

#220

Post by thomasfoster96 »

kllrnohj wrote: post #111
dskhatri wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His point is more about not putting all your eggs in one basket; you certainly don't tell your barista about an upcoming physician's appointment, or that you are in the market for a house. Your barista is also disconnected from parties who may leverage the information you provide him/her. Similarly, you don't tell your broker that you prefer Ethiopian coffee. Google offers so many services that it has a much broader…

Except the author then proceeds to toss all his eggs into Apple's basket. No, it's not about putting all the eggs in one basket, it's about paranoidly avoiding Google at all costs for some unknown reason.

This unknown reason is probably because he runs DuckDuckGo and hence wants people to not use Google, worry about their privacy and use it instead.
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