NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide • Hacker News Board

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#211

Post by danbruc » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:12 PM UTC

allochthon wrote: post #206

danbruc wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am at a loss for words. Arrogant, self-righteous, disrespectful, ignorant, mendacious...nothing cuts it. It is illegal in the US but who cares about the rest of the world? I can not remember when something similar made me that angry as the current conduct of the US does. If I would not know better that this would negatively affect the whole world and innocent US citizens and that emotional reactions are usually not…

I would just cut all cables to the US, ... deny US citizens to enter any foreign country and then just do your shit over there and get happy with it. Whoah, there. Your grievances are well-placed. But keep in mind that it's a certain subset of agencies in the US government that are responsible for the problems you're upset about, not all US citizens. As for fixing things, the government has become literally unmanagea…

That's why I mentioned »innocent US citizens«. ;)

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#212

Post by acqq » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:13 PM UTC

bo1024 wrote: post #118

acqq wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you would use one-time-pad before storing to the cloud you'd either need to store the very same pad on the cloud, then effectively not needing encryption, or you wouldn't need the cloud, as the amount of the encrypted data would match the amount of the pad data one to one. And homomorphic encryption is still far from being practical.

Sure, one would more realistically use any standard encryption scheme. Agreed on homomorphic encryption as mentioned in my previous comment. But "impractical" is a far cry from "fundamentally impossible".

Impractical is in sense "nobody can actually it, only the papers are written about it." Practically impossible to use.

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#213

Post by jlgreco » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:14 PM UTC

brown9-2 wrote: post #171

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> actions taken abroad aimed at non-US persons. And there is an interesting counterpoint to that, e.g. > "If the Americans eavesdropped on cellphones in Germany, they broke German law on German soil, and those responsible must be held accountable." http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2013/10/28/world/obama-unaw...

All espionage that Country A does in Country B is illegal in Country B. That's why it's espionage.

You are missing the "and therefore there it is unreasonable for you to be upset" leap.

Pointing out that illegal things are illegal isn't really a interesting contribution to the discussion, is it? I assume that wasn't all you meant to do.

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#214

Post by jlgreco » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:17 PM UTC

gcb0 wrote: post #203

danbruc wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who cares about the collateral damage done to US citizens? The problem is the damage done to non-US citizens.

What?! since when non-us citzens can vote? remember that democracy (even half-implemented as it is in the US) is the dictatorship or the majority (that can vote).

If voters are concerned with the plight of non-voters, then the plight of non-voters is by definition of concern to voters.

Asking voters to be concerned with what their government does to non-voters should never be discouraged. It may be futile, but it should not be discouraged.

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#215

Post by wil421 » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:17 PM UTC

kamjam wrote: post #75

hackula1 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I imagine anyone with a line on their resume that says "NSA - Software Developer - 2009:Present" is going to have a hard time finding a new job at many companies (although certainly not all).

On the flip side of that, maybe you do want ex-NSA staff with the inside knowledge so you can protect yourself against their tactics. Isn't that the same reasoning for hiring ex-black hat hackers?

I am pretty sure they would be considered a traitor if someone told their new company how the NSA was doing things, just look at what they are calling Snowden.

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#216

Post by DannyBee » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:18 PM UTC

mapgrep wrote: post #104

ori_b wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google was letting information flow between its data center completely unencrypted until last month. http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/technology/google-enc... . Last month! Over their own private WAN. The analogy would be sending things in the clear over your LAN. [Citation: http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/~rcs/research/google-onrc-slide... ]

The likelihood miles and miles of cabling, much of it presumably leased, will be compromised is nowhere near comparable to the likelihood a normal, single-location office/home ethernet LAN will be compromised. (And if you think both are easily compromised, that only adds to my original point.)

"much of it presumably leased,"

This is a very interesting assumption

http://www.howstuffworks.com/tech-myths/5-myths-about-google...

http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=633236

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#217

Post by spunky » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:19 PM UTC

bradleyjg wrote: post #41

tptacek wrote: post #2

It's hard not to come to the conclusion that these activities were essentially criminal. I don't see how the administration can fail to disavow them, investigate them fully, and hold their instigators accountable. It feels like Special Prosecutor time. That aside, let me re-make a point I keep making: Google had no knowledge of NSA's physical compromise of their data centers. But still, they pushed harder than anyone…

> It's hard not to come to the conclusion that these activities were essentially criminal. I don't see how the administration can fail to disavow them, investigate them fully, and hold their instigators accountable. It feels like Special Prosecutor time. The government takes the position that their agents are almost completely unconstrained by law when it comes to actions taken abroad aimed at non-US persons. Even we…

Monroe Doctrine 2.0

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#218

Post by DannyBee » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:19 PM UTC

bradleyjg wrote: post #41

tptacek wrote: post #2

It's hard not to come to the conclusion that these activities were essentially criminal. I don't see how the administration can fail to disavow them, investigate them fully, and hold their instigators accountable. It feels like Special Prosecutor time. That aside, let me re-make a point I keep making: Google had no knowledge of NSA's physical compromise of their data centers. But still, they pushed harder than anyone…

> It's hard not to come to the conclusion that these activities were essentially criminal. I don't see how the administration can fail to disavow them, investigate them fully, and hold their instigators accountable. It feels like Special Prosecutor time. The government takes the position that their agents are almost completely unconstrained by law when it comes to actions taken abroad aimed at non-US persons. Even we…

"The government takes the position that their agents are almost completely unconstrained by law when it comes to actions taken abroad aimed at non-US persons. "

It's worse than this. You also generally can't sue the US government civilly unless they allow you to. US has abrogated sovereign immunity in certain situations for certain types of torts, but ..

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#219

Post by lazugod » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:20 PM UTC

sage_joch wrote: post #132

If I scroll the Reddit frontpage (without being logged in), I am not seeing any NSA stories, despite being on the top of /r/WorldNews, /r/news, etc. Anyone know the story behind that?

/r/worldnews is no longer a default sub, so none of its posts appear on logged-out frontpage anyways.

Re: NSA infiltrates links to Yahoo, Google data centers worldwide

#220

Post by lazyjones » Wed, Oct 30, 2013, 7:20 PM UTC

cs702 wrote: post #208

Wow. Years ago, I remember reading Richard Stallman's "How I do my computing"[1], an essay in which he explains why he usually does not connect to any websites from his own machine, downloads web pages from a headless browser running in some server, does not have any user accounts for any web applications, does not buy anything over the Internet ever, does not use any social networking sites, and otherwise abstains f…

> It turns out Stallman was just (far) ahead of his time -- as usual.

Indeed, and it was always obvious if you took security seriously instead of regarding it as a game of probabilities and trade-offs where convenience wins.

As we are being pulled very strongly towards a future where everything and everyone is connected all the time, we should really consider such radical approaches again and how to make them more convenient for "normal" people.