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VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

arxiv.org

211–220 of 226 posts

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try 27b, it's significantly smarter than 35b-a3b (although it is slower, it's not so bad with MTP).

It is, but it's way too slow on a Strix Halo due to its limited bandwidth. (I'm still sad that they didn't make a 122B-A10B version of it, as it's the kind of model that fits best on a Strix Halo, and for 3.5 it was comparable in performance to the dense 27B version).

3.5's 122-A10B is still great!

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#212
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given this and the quality of open models, it makes no sense to me that there’s a future for Anthropic et all?

Packaging a capability into a consumable form will still be business. It's like web hosting; all the open source tools are there and free, and yet website tools, hosts, etc flourish.

Exactly, it's like web hosting.

And I don't see a lot of web hosts with twelve-digit valuations.

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#213
post #100

What is the idiots guude to run this one local now?

Ask an existing LLM harness like Claude Code. "Install this and run the demo program" or "Set this up with llama-server" or "Give me an Open WebUI page for this model" will work.

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#214
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Education had this sad 15 year period where it thought “competences” are all you need. Turns out that without the world knowledge to have a base of facts, it is not.

Basically: you can't teach people to think without giving them some facts and ideas to think with. It's like trying to teach woodworking without giving the students any wood.

No, but you could teach them rapid skill acquisition first, then the basics of woodworking, and they'd be off. They could then apply the same approach to machining. Instead, people absorb the meta-skill through osmosis. The first thing we should teach, starting with reading, is how to learn.

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#215
post #46

Does python coding depend on political facts of the world? It might appear not, but actually, the process of reasoning is not an isolated act. The right and wrong way of doing things is codified in social evolution that absorbed all facets of life. Why should you optimize a piece of code for performance? Why performance is needed? What is a bug? What features and UI themes would be more intuitive for humans? There is…

True, but this model provides something of a lower bound on just how much world knowledge is really needed for unrelated reasoning tasks. That lower bound appears to be quite low indeed. Lower than I thought it would turn out to be.

This thing is just bonkers.

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#216
So I went ahead and quickly vibecoded a working harness with a barebones tool interface and some constraints on output (credit to noperator for the idea). github: https://github.com/NickalasLight/VibeHarness.git

Its meant for a Windows machine using ollama but I'm sure anyone who wants to mess with it can point claude code at it to convert it for your own operating system and requirements. After install you can ask it to do something with "vibe 'create me a poem about cheese in cheese.txt'" its workspace is by default the directory the cli was located in when you called it.

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#217
post #94
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, if they can fit an 8B model that's really good at improving the output by thinking, running at 16K tok/s on Taalas would be mind-blowing.

Given this and the quality of open models, it makes no sense to me that there’s a future for Anthropic et all?

it's not like anthropic will stop improving their models

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't you just force it to do structured output via constrained generation?

Yes, I did end up figuring out a clean way to allow normal reasoning inside and then force JSON _after_ the closing . Example here: https://gist.github.com/noperator/6c711ab19027ea8056442df839...

Thanks for that, and credit to you for the idea, I quickly vibe coded (heh) a working minimal tool calling harness thats allows it to make multiple tool calls each turn. Currently its working pretty damn well all things considered: https://github.com/NickalasLight/VibeHarness.git

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#219
post #100

What is the idiots guude to run this one local now?

Ask an existing LLM harness like Claude Code. "Install this and run the demo program" or "Set this up with llama-server" or "Give me an Open WebUI page for this model" will work.

[dead]

Re: VibeThinker: 3B param model that beats Opus 4.5 on reasoning with novel SFT+GRPO

#220
I still cannot trust evaluations and benchmarks. How can you prove that the test datasets are truly unseen examples?

I think the only way to prove that these models are truly as good as they claim is to wait and see if they are getting adopted in practice.

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