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A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

coveillance.org

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Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#211

Post by Schiendelman »

toast0 wrote: post #197
fny wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your forgetting the nonsense a defense attorney will conjure. How do you know he didn't buy the car from the thief? We had a similar issue with the hit and run of my grandfather: even though video evidence found the car and later saw the suspect leave the car, the detectives worried a defence attorney would argue someone else may have been driving at the time the accident (e.g his wife), and therefore "beyond reasona…

My brother bought a stolen motorcycle once. He checked with California DMV before purchasing it, and IIRC, the DMV issued him a title. Several months later, the local PD came over, asked him a lot of questions, took the motorcycle and let him go. Of course, he couldn't get in touch with the seller again, so he was just out the money. Stolen property doesn't come with a sticker indicating it's stolen.

Doesn't carfax help with this? Ensuring the person it's registered to is the one who's selling it?

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#212

Post by lovich »

bonoboTP wrote: post #193
dylan604 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope. The jury was to give the sentence. This depends on jurisdiction when the jury does the sentencing. Capital murder cases are a famous example. I guess I was lucky that my local jurisdiction said GTA was worth of a jury sentencing?? The defense attorney was looking for jurors sympathetic to giving his client the least time possible. The prosecutor was looking for people to throw the book at the defendant and be o…

It seems that the selection process optimizes for either liars or dumb people who are easiest to emotionally manipulate. If you appear very reflective and capable of complex thought, you're a risk. You could've said, you're open to whatever sentence, you make no prior commitment and will decide for whatever sentence is appropriate based on the court proceedings and the law as given by the judge. But they would have c…

> It seems that the selection process optimizes for either liars or dumb people who are easiest to emotionally manipulate.

It does. Having expert knowledge is a deal breaker too. I actually want to serve on a jury but because I am unwilling to lie to a judge I’ve been bounced everytime when I am asked if I would believe the police testimony and I reply with “that would depend on if they were a Brady cop”

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#213

Post by toast0 »

Schiendelman wrote: post #211
toast0 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My brother bought a stolen motorcycle once. He checked with California DMV before purchasing it, and IIRC, the DMV issued him a title. Several months later, the local PD came over, asked him a lot of questions, took the motorcycle and let him go. Of course, he couldn't get in touch with the seller again, so he was just out the money. Stolen property doesn't come with a sticker indicating it's stolen.

Doesn't carfax help with this? Ensuring the person it's registered to is the one who's selling it?

Checking with the title registration agency (California DMV) would have seemed to help, but it didn't. Not sure engaging a 3rd party service would help either.

Carfax on an old enough car seems pretty silly too, I dunno.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#214

Post by mixmastamyk »

butlike wrote: post #161
mixmastamyk wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bank records are readily available, large cash transactions as well.

Need a subpoena/warrant for those records. Don't know the intricacies of that, but I doubt a judge would grant the warrant unless they had the person dead-to-rights and were going after a bigger fish higher up on the chain.

Warrants were never hard to get for a good-faith case and increasingly ignored for others.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#215

Post by lovich »

raincole wrote: post #36
patja wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still trying to figure out how I feel about statements like these which seem to assume the reader is incredibly uninformed and naive, to the point of condescension. "sends the information to a central storing place (called a database)" TIL what the word database means? "Amazon can use your purchases to know more about you using patterns." Is this news to someone? Condescending. "It might be connected to a network…

I think these criticisms are unjustified. The article could be aiming for less tech-savvy people. Remember the most tech-savvy people in the world are those who enabled the surveillance infrastructure in the first place. Also if you want any meaningful grassroot change, you need to appeal to the less knowledgeable cohorts. Politics is more or less "which informed people can convince the most uninformed ones." > Is th…

A bit of xkcd 2501 going on in this thread as well

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#217

Post by fragmede »

VohuMana wrote: post #177
runjake wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you're wondering what is being discussed in the meetings about whether or not more surveillance should be deployed, at the city and county levels, this is it. Crime isn't being prosecuted, the criminals know it, and this breeds more crime (and more criminals). Even when they are imprisoned and incarcerated, they're probably in jail for somewhere between 24 hours and a few weeks. They know pretty much everyone else…

Honest question, do we know why crime isn’t being prosecuted anymore? I’ve noticed where I live this definitely seems to be the case and has a two fold effect, police aren’t even bothering to enforce laws because when they do the city/county refuses to prosecute and then criminals are getting wise to this and escalating their crimes. Previously where I live there would be violent crimes but generally in the early hou…

The popularity of the ACAB meme did not exactly endear the local populace with the local police in more liberal cities.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#218

Post by hsbauauvhabzb »

mikestew wrote: post #216
hsbauauvhabzb wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’ve just presented an anecdote with no factual evidence and no video footage. It’s one sided hearsay.

You could have just asked for a URL.

One could have been provided, or even a name to google.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#219

Post by Computer0 »

stickfigure wrote: post #53
trbleclef wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's that quote about essential Liberty and temporary Safety again...

When you get a gun pointed at your face, or your home violated, or your car stolen, you tend to rebalance your principles a little. The cameras are a symptom of bigger problems.

It's a bit of a protection racket isn't it? The police extort me for money and claim it will be used to protect me from the situations your present. Yet they do none of those things, because they can't be there in that moment. The police are not the solution. Spying on me is not the solution.

Re: A walking tour of surveillance infrastructure in Seattle (2020)

#220

Post by Computer0 »

forrestthewoods wrote: post #56
trbleclef wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's that quote about essential Liberty and temporary Safety again...

It’s a pretty unhelpful quite imho. You can use that quote to oppose anything beyond pure anarchy! Yes the police can be abusive tyrants. But a society with no rules and no rule enforces is not a prosperous society. And yet if you lived in total anarchy you could oppose anything beyond pure rules and any rule enforcement with that quote. Clearly the slope is very very very very very slippery. And yet the ideal, dare…

Can you show me the contract I signed that shows I agree to adhere to those rules? This is forced upon us with no choice by the individual other than to not participate and live in destitute conditions or in jail. The police are enforcers of rule, and for that I will always oppose them.
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