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Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

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Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#211
post #170
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This model is small enough that it might be sensible to try the same prompts against all of the quant sizes to try and spot any differences.

This inspired me to give that a go: https://simonw.github.io/granite-4.1-3b-gguf-pelicans/

That was interesting almost like a weird little modern art gallery. I’m surprised that the BF16 one looks so bad…

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#212
post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is the signal/noise ratio in these articles. If the AI has written the article, then this same info could have been generated by my own AI, but tailored to my needs. So what, exactly, is the new info that this article is generating that I can use to consult with my AI? That's what I want to get out of this interaction. Maybe my point is something on the lines of "Just send me the prompt"[0] [0] https://bl…

prompt + all other bits of information the context has been seeded with before the output was created (documents, web searches, other sources) in which case it might be more efficient to just consume the final deliverable (yourself or via LLM).

Fair point. We could classify AI generated articles in two categories:

1) articles generated with context data that's trivial to find (or even embedded into the model)

2) articles generated with context data that's hard to find or not publicly available

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#213
>"Stage two was RLHF training on general chat prompts using a reward model to improve helpfulness. This worked. AlpacaEval scores jumped around 18.9 points on average compared to the fine-tuned checkpoints.

Then something broke. The RLHF stage, while improving chat quality, caused math benchmark scores to drop. GSM8K and DeepMind-Math both regressed."

Observation: Math (which when fully decomposed, results in Logic) is at the core of how computers (traditional/older, non-LLM, programming languages work. If an LLM gets Math training wrong at any stage for any reason, then, in my opinion, that should be viewed as something that needs to be fixed at a lower level, not a higher one; not a later training level...

I think it would be interesting exercise to train an LLM that only deals in simple Math, simple English, and only the ability to compute simple equations (+,-,x,/)... like, what's the absolute minimum in terms of text and layers necessary to train a model like that?

I think some interesting understandings could be potentially be had by experimentation like that...

I myself would love a pure (simplest, smallest possible)

Text-to-Math only LLM (TTMLLM, TTMSLM?)

, along with all of the necessary corpuses (which would ideally be as small as possible) and instructions necessary to train such an LLM...

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know, but that is not my point.

You never had one. You tried to be clever and failed.

I don’t know. Since you are perhaps clever, can you show me the training datasets and recipes so I can replicate this model locally? I have access to good HPCs.

I think it’s fair if you use a bit more than 5 seconds as someone stated above. I would gladly be proven stupid.

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The training datasets are listed there and are all open source. > the complete recipes to make the models. You mean the weights which most companies don't release. Again you can find from that link.

Where is the list? No I didn't mean the weights, but the source code to make the weights.

I'd like to assume you are not trolling and just want everything handed to you.

The granite site covers everything you keep asking for. Granite is made using lm-engine and the details are there.

Without the weights you are not going to be able to build to the same level of accuracy without some serious work.

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You never had one. You tried to be clever and failed.

I don’t know. Since you are perhaps clever, can you show me the training datasets and recipes so I can replicate this model locally? I have access to good HPCs. I think it’s fair if you use a bit more than 5 seconds as someone stated above. I would gladly be proven stupid.

https://github.com/ibm-granite

https://huggingface.co/ibm-granite

I think if you were genuinely interested, you could have found this yourself.

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on the purpose of the image. If it's used to create a false narrative (like a deep fake), sure, you should care. But if it's used as an alternative to a stock photo, or as an easy way to make an infographic then no, I don't think you should care.

> you should care Why should I care? The world is full of false narratives. How can I have the bandwidth to care about everything all of the time? I swear that more than half of the complaining that I find here comes from priveledged people bike shedding over inane topics, and who have never had to really worry about serious survival-level (how am I going to eat today?) issues in their lives.

> Why should I care? The world is full of false narratives.

Why submit to the false narratives proliferation? It's goal is to make everyone's lives worse, including yours.

From the mere fact USA has a staggering number of school massacres doesn't mean we all should stop caring.

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know. Since you are perhaps clever, can you show me the training datasets and recipes so I can replicate this model locally? I have access to good HPCs. I think it’s fair if you use a bit more than 5 seconds as someone stated above. I would gladly be proven stupid.

https://github.com/ibm-granite https://huggingface.co/ibm-granite I think if you were genuinely interested, you could have found this yourself.

This is not what I asked?

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the list? No I didn't mean the weights, but the source code to make the weights.

I'd like to assume you are not trolling and just want everything handed to you. The granite site covers everything you keep asking for. Granite is made using lm-engine and the details are there. Without the weights you are not going to be able to build to the same level of accuracy without some serious work.

I want open source to stay a label for actual open source software. That means handing everything to me yes.

Re: Granite 4.1: IBM's 8B Model Matching 32B MoE

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the list? No I didn't mean the weights, but the source code to make the weights.

I'd like to assume you are not trolling and just want everything handed to you. The granite site covers everything you keep asking for. Granite is made using lm-engine and the details are there. Without the weights you are not going to be able to build to the same level of accuracy without some serious work.

No, it doesn't.
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