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Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

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Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#211

Post by Fokamul »

All this C&Ds and shutdowns are possible, because whole WOW private servers community are against each other.

Turtle WOW owners have long history of scams (gold selling) and DDOSing other servers then buying them or something like that.

Warmane uses unpatched RCE in 335a client for their own Anticheat (yes, rofl) and their custom content changes.

Project Ascension, worst Pay2Win there is. Someone said they have more employees than there is Blizzard employees working on Wow Classic.

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Wow private servers run for decades now and nobody ever did something to "fix" copyright infringement. Every private server linked or hosted Wow clients directly on their websites.

Servers emulators (which are not emulators, wow community just call them like that) are ok, since they're re-implemented only from packet communication between clients and official servers.

Problem is copying dungeons (raids, scripting) behavior and other things.

There wasn't any motivation to fund development of opensource wow client, this way only players would broke copyright, if they would be required to provide client copyrighted data by themselves. And over time, it could be also redone more even now, with LLM.

Hosting private WOW servers always was about making huge money and very quickly, I know people with multiple houses and cars only from hosting one server and they never ever did something custom like Turtle Wow. You could just download opensource wow server implementation, rent a server, setup payment gateway and the hardest thing was to come up with the cool name for your server :D

It's easy, because players have no problem to start on new server several times per year, since that's all they do on their main private server. There is reset each year and they're usually waiting when some raid will open etc.

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Nobody sane would player on official Wow servers, Blizzard is openly supporting botting and real money trading.

There is even opensource bot coded by Microsoft employee :D

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#212

Post by Chaosvex »

saadn92 wrote: post #29

I ran a private server years ago. Two things people in this thread are getting wrong: The engineering is way harder than anyone gives credit for. You're reverse engineering a server protocol from the client binary, writing your own spell systems (thousands of spells, each with edge cases), pathing, instancing, combat mechanics. Then scaling it for a few thousand concurrent players on hardware you're paying for out of…

Crazily misleading comment. It's absolutely profit.

One machine can handle over 15,000 players. There's very little to the 'scaling' and the costs are quite low. Low enough that larger projects have managed it without being funded.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#213

Post by p0w3n3d »

ionwake wrote: post #195

I find it almost comic how large companies make terrible decisions. I dont need to have played Turtle Wow to know how bad this looks for optics. Game company with lots of money tries to take money of a few people who are make a mod for their game, breaking it in the process. It doesn't matter how you try to spin this, "ACHTUALLY Blizzard has the right..." etc Its almost like some MSC Business intern started the meeti…

I'd say it's this 'constant growth' coercion, and 'optimise without measure' thing.

We must report another 10% growth so we find that some guys are playing for free (it's 20k of them). We write in excel the newly found "amount of freebies", then make a plan and show on a Powerpoint presentation, that this 20k players (the number 100% we're certain about - or at least we're trying to lie to ourselves that it is certain) will join our server which gives 260k usd a month. Nobody can prove we're wrong, so we pay 260k for lawyers and poof - there goes the 'pirate' server.

Next year we'll find another way, but for now, just drink and dance.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#214

Post by [deleted] »

charcircuit wrote: post #76
drbscl wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counter-Strike Every MOBA that exists (DotA, LoL, HoN, etc) Team Fortress Killing Floor PUBG Natural Selection Undoubtedly, many more that I can't recall off the top of my head.

>Counter-Strike, Team Fortress, Natural Selection These games used the GoldSrc engine. Any game built on this engine gets called a mod. But this is not what most people actually think of when people are talking about mods. Rust is not a mod of Unity. These are game engines that people built a game using. >DotA This was a custom map. Not a mod. >LoL, HoN These were built on in house game engines and were not a mod. >P…

[deleted]

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#215

Post by Fokamul »

Chaosvex wrote: post #212
saadn92 wrote: post #29

I ran a private server years ago. Two things people in this thread are getting wrong: The engineering is way harder than anyone gives credit for. You're reverse engineering a server protocol from the client binary, writing your own spell systems (thousands of spells, each with edge cases), pathing, instancing, combat mechanics. Then scaling it for a few thousand concurrent players on hardware you're paying for out of…

Crazily misleading comment. It's absolutely profit. One machine can handle over 15,000 players. There's very little to the 'scaling' and the costs are quite low. Low enough that larger projects have managed it without being funded.

Yes, exactly.

How expensive is this:

Download opensource wow server from github

Rent a server VM.

Come up with very cool name, like MurlocWOW

Create Discord for it.

Post AD to reddit/wowservers

Run server

Day 1, several thousands of players will join by themselves. Because everyone looks for something "new" for free.

Profit?

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#216

Post by Fokamul »

noobermin wrote: post #166
saadn92 wrote: post #29

I ran a private server years ago. Two things people in this thread are getting wrong: The engineering is way harder than anyone gives credit for. You're reverse engineering a server protocol from the client binary, writing your own spell systems (thousands of spells, each with edge cases), pathing, instancing, combat mechanics. Then scaling it for a few thousand concurrent players on hardware you're paying for out of…

> Blizzard is right to protect their IP. They should have just taken their binaries, trained on the outputs (frames may be) run a few simulations games, and produced WoW-GPT. Blizzard would be working out to acquihire them for millions. Wrong move Turtle WoW.

You're naive thinking that Blizzard wants to make something new and creative.

They're just milking current players and they even let people to bot and RMT. Without banning anybody.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#217

Post by drbscl »

Aerroon wrote: post #116
drbscl wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counter-Strike Every MOBA that exists (DotA, LoL, HoN, etc) Team Fortress Killing Floor PUBG Natural Selection Undoubtedly, many more that I can't recall off the top of my head.

The autochess genre (Teamfight Tactics) is basically a mod of a mod since it started as a custom game in Dota 2.

Yeah, that's the big one that escaped my memory

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#218

Post by deaux »

nozzlegear wrote: post #105
deaux wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No more billionaires.

Gabe Newell is literally a billionaire.

And Buzz Aldrin was an alcoholic, doesn't mean preventing alcoholism is bad for society.

This whole thread is pointing out Valve is the _exception_.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#219

Post by bombcar »

cedws wrote: post #187
saadn92 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WoW (classic era through MoP) stores all game assets in MPQ archives. The client has a built-in override system it loads patch files in order (patch-1.mpq, patch-2.mpq, ... patch-A.mpq, patch-B.mpq etc...) and later patches override earlier ones. So to add custom content, you just drop a new patch-X.mpq into the Data/ folder with your modified files and the client picks them up automatically. For something like Turtl…

Thanks. That architecture lends itself to modding so well you'd think it's intentional.

Each patch is essentially a mod on the previous version to limit the amount of bandwidth-WoW had a number of things like that that aren’t strictly necessary anymore.

Re: Turtle WoW classic server announces shutdown after Blizzard wins injunction

#220

Post by goolz »

Fokamul wrote: post #215
Chaosvex wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazily misleading comment. It's absolutely profit. One machine can handle over 15,000 players. There's very little to the 'scaling' and the costs are quite low. Low enough that larger projects have managed it without being funded.

Yes, exactly. How expensive is this: Download opensource wow server from github Rent a server VM. Come up with very cool name, like MurlocWOW Create Discord for it. Post AD to reddit/wowservers Run server Day 1, several thousands of players will join by themselves. Because everyone looks for something "new" for free. Profit?

Did you ever play Turtle? They did a lot more than just that, as per the top comment in this lineage, and were serving a subset of the community by listening to what people want. Turtle WoW was popular because Blizzard and the shareholders do not care about making a fun and engaging game. They care about you spending money in their store and finding ways to poison the economy with their own gold buying system. WoW died in December 2010, the true spirit at least. Makes me sad to say that, and I hope Classic+ is everything we dreamed, but framing Turtle as just another private server is disingenuous. They were on the wrong side of the law, and perhaps they did get some money for their efforts, but at least they tried harder than the entire WoW Classic team combined.
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