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MinIO repository is no longer maintained

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Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#211
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, but that's only half of it. The second half is that open source users should stop imagining the things they choose to use for free as "products". Users of open source often feel entitled, open issues like they would open a support ticket for product they actually paid for, and don't hesitate to show their frustration. Of course that's not all the users, but the maintainers only see those (the happy users are…

I think this gets complicated when you have larger open source projects where contributors change over time. By taking over stewardship of something that people depend on you should have some obligation to not intentionally fuck those people over even if you are not paid for it. This is also true to some extend when it's a project you started. I don't think you should e.g. be able to point to the typical liability di…

> By taking over stewardship of something that people depend on you should have some obligation

No. If it's free and open source, all it says is what you can do with the code. There is no obligation towards the users whatsoever.

If you choose to depend on something, it's your problem. The professional way to do it is either to contractually make sure that the project doesn't "fuck you over" (using your words), or to make sure that you are able to fork the project if necessary.

If you base your business on the fact that someone will be working for you, for free, forever, then it's your problem.

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#212
post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes the software is under AGPL. Go forth and forkify. The choice of AGPL tells you that they wanted to be the only commercial source of the software from the beginning.

> the software is under AGPL. Go forth and forkify. No, what was minio is now aistor, a closed-source proprietary software. Tell me how to fork it and I will. > they wanted to be the only commercial source of the software The choice of AGPL tells me nothing more than what is stated in the license. And I definitely don't intend to close the source of any of my AGPL-licensed projects.

[deleted]

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is this mythical social contract found? I stand by my point: it's a software license, not a marriage. Free users certainly would like it to be a social contract like I would like to be gifted a million dollars. Sadly, I still have to work and can't infinitely rely on the generosity of others.

Where is the contract to return the shopping cart to the corral?

I always preferred people who didn’t, when I worked in retail. It generates a nice chill task (wander around the parking lot looking for carts). But if you want to do a favor for the faceless retailer, go for it. Mostly I chuck my cart in the corral to get it out of my way, but this sees more like a morally-neutral action to me.

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#214
post #150

I successfully migrated from MinIO to Ceph, which I highly recommend. Along the way, I tested SeaweedFS, which looked promising. However, I ran into a strange bug, and after diagnosing it with the help of Claude, I realized the codebase was vibe-coded and riddled with a staggering number of structural errors. In my opinion, SeaweedFS should absolutely not be used for anything beyond testing — otherwise you're almost…

Seaweed has been around for a long time. I think you just discovered what legacy codebases look like.

Laughed reading this. We pretend Claude can't code because we don't like to acknowledge what code always turns out looking like, which is exactly what it's trained on

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no way that maintaining something is an ethical obligation, regardless of popularity. There is only legal obligation, for commercial products.

If offering a tie in thing supposedly free of charge without warning that would end once it serves a party less profit purpose then yes. Ethics are not obligations, they are moral principles. Not having principles doesn't send you to prison that is why it isn't law. It makes you lose moral credit though.

> If offering a tie in thing supposedly free of charge without warning that would end once it serves a party less profit purpose then yes

Claiming that you’re entitled to free R&D forever because someone once gave you something of value seems like a great way to ensure that nobody does that again. You got over a decade of development by a skilled team, it’s not exactly beyond the pale that the business climate has changed since then.

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#217
post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most open source projects start small. The author writes code that solves some issue they have. Likely, someone else has the same problem and they would find the code useful. So it's published. For a while it's quiet, but one day a second user shows up and they like it. Maybe something isn't clear or they have a suggestion. That's reasonable and supporting one person doesn't take much. Then the third user shows up. T…

All of that sounds reasonable. But it also doesn't need to be a reason to find maintaining OSS very draining or unpleasant, as GP put it. First of all, when a project grows, its core team of maintainers can also grow, so that the maintenance burden can be shared. This is up to the original author(s) to address if they think their workload is a problem. Secondly, and coming back to the post that started this thread, t…

Honestly, I don't see how you're adding anything here other than inflated expectations and a strange anti-individual pro-mega-corporation ideology.

Fundamentally your post boils down to this: All contributions should be self funded by the person making them.

This might seem acceptable at first glance, but it has some really perverse implications that are far worse than making a product customers are willing to pay for.

To be granted the right to work on an open source project, you must have a day job that isn't affiliated with the project. You must first work eight hours a day to ensure your existence, only after those eight hours are up, are you allowed to work on the open source project.

Every other form of labor is allowed to charge for money, even the street cleaner or the elderly janitor stocking up on his pension, everyone except the open source developer and that everyone includes people who work on behalf of a company that directly earns money off the open source project, including software developers hired by said company even if those software developers work full time on the open source project. This means that you can run into absurd scenarios like SF salaries being paid for contributors, while the maintainer, who might be happy with an average polish developer salary doesn't even get the little amount they would need to live a hermit life doing nothing but working on the project. No, that maintainer is expected, I mean obligated, to keep working his day job to then be granted the privilege of working for free.

Somehow the maintainer is the selfish one for wanting his desire to exist be equally as important as other people's desire for the project to exist. The idea that people value the project but not the process that brings about the project sounds deeply suspect.

Your complaint that prioritizing paid feature is bad is disturbing, because of the above paragraph. The maintainer is expected to donate his resources for the greater good, but in instances where the maintainer could acquire resources to donate to the public at large through the project itself, he must not do so, because he must acquire the donation resources through his day job. To be allowed to prioritize the project, he must deprioritize the project.

The strangest part by far though is that if you are a company that produces and sells proprietary software, you're the good guy. As I said in the beginning. This feels like a very anti OSS stance since open source software is only allowed to exist in the shadow of proprietary software that makes money. The argument is always that certain types of software should not exist and that the things that are supposedly being withheld are more important than the things being created.

I personally think this type of subtractive thinking is very insidious. You can have the best intentions in the world and still be branded the devil. Meanwhile the devil can do whatever he wants. There is always this implicit demand that you ought to be an actual devil for the good of everyone.

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#218
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it's not about the money. for large open source projects you need to allocate time to deal with the community. for someone that just wants to put code out there that is very draining and unpleasant. most projects won't ever reach that level though.

> it's not about the money OP sure makes it sound like it's about the money. > for someone that just wants to put code out there that is very draining and unpleasant. I never understood this. Then why publish the code in the first place? If the goal is to help others, then the decent thing would be to add documentation and support the people who care enough to use your project. This doesn't mean bending to all their…

> support the people who care enough to use your project.

You make that sound like they are helping the developer. The help is going the other way, it seems to me.

Re: MinIO repository is no longer maintained

#219

I ran a moderately large opensource service and my chronic back pain was cured the day I stopped maintaining the project. Working for free is not fun. Having a paid offering with a free community version is not fun. Ultimately, dealing with people who don't pay for your product is not fun. I learnt this the hard way and I guess the MinIO team learnt this as well.

Ex mailcow owner here. Can confirm. Hard times.

I loved everyone in the community though. By heart. You were the best.

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