Many of us predicted OpenAIs insistence that the model was the product was the wrong path. The tools on top of the models are the path and people building things faster is the value.
The model is the product. OpenAI themselves also build products on top of their models. Those without models are hugely vulnerable to sudden rug pulls.
The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
211–220 of 309 posts
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
Was the golden boy for a while? What shifted? I don't even remember what he did "first" to get the status. Is it maybe just a case of familiarity breeding contempt?
It is starting to become clear to more and more people that Sam is a dyed in the wool True Believer in AGI. While it's obvious in hindsight that OpenAI would never have gotten anywhere if he wasn't, seeing it so starkly is really rubbing a lot of people the wrong way.
it's that he has no ethics to speak of at all. it's not that he's out of touch, it's that he simply does not care.
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#213Earlier quoted context omitted.
He is a pretty interesting case. According to the book "Empire of AI" about OpenAI, he lies constantly, even about things that are too trivial to matter. So it may be part of some compulsive behavior. And when two people want different things from him, he "resolves" the conflict by agreeing with each of them separately, and then each assumes they got what they wanted, until they talk to the other person and find out…
He was once a big pin in Y Combinator (I think kind of ran it?)... Paul Graham thought he was great for YC. Interesting that he's got as far as he has with this issue. I don't think you can run a company effectively if you don't deal in truth. Some of his videos have seemed quite bizarre as well, quite sarcastic about concerns people have about AI in general.
And today it seems everyone will at YC hate him but pretend not
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#214Not only has OpenAI's market share gone down significantly in the last 6mo, Nvidia has been using its newfound liquid funds to train its own family of models[1]. An alliance with OpenAI just makes less sense today than it did 6mo ago. [1] https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/open-models-data-tools-acceler...
> Nvidia has been using its newfound liquid funds to train its own family of models Nvidia has always had its own family of models, it's nothing new and not something you should read too much into IMHO. They use those as template other people can leverage and they are of course optimized for Nvidia hardware. Nvidia has been training models in the Megatron family as well as many others since at least 2019 which was us…
Megatron was a research project.
NVidia has professional services selling companies on using Nemo for user facing applications.
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#215Not only has OpenAI's market share gone down significantly in the last 6mo, Nvidia has been using its newfound liquid funds to train its own family of models[1]. An alliance with OpenAI just makes less sense today than it did 6mo ago. [1] https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/open-models-data-tools-acceler...
I think there are two things that happened 1. OpenAI bet largely on consumer. Consumers have mostly rejected AI. And in a lot of cases even hate it (can't go on TikTok or Reddit without people calling something slop, or hating on AI generated content). Anthropic on the other hand went all in on B2B and coding. That seems to be the much better market to be in. 2. Sam Altman is profoundly unlikable.
People like to complain about things, but consumers are heavily using AI.
ChatGPT.com is now up to the 4th most visited website in the world: https://explodingtopics.com/blog/chatgpt-users
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#216> He[Jensen Huang] has also privately criticized what he has described as a lack of discipline in OpenAI’s business approach and expressed concern about the competition it faces from the likes of Google and Anthropic, some of the people said.
Companies like Google produce and operate AI models largely using their own TPUs rather than NVidia's GPUs. We've seen the Chinese produce pretty competitive open models with either older NVidia GPUs or alternative GPUs because they are not allowed to buy the newer ones. And AMD, Intel and other chip makers are also eager to get in on the action. Companies like Microsoft, Amazon, etc. have their own chips as well (similar to Google). All the hyperscalers are moving away from NVidia.
And then Apple runs a non Intel and non NVidia based range of workstations and laptops that are pretty popular with AI researchers because the M series CPU/GPU/NPU is pretty decent value for running AI models. You see similar movement with ARM chips from Qualcomm and others. They all want to run AI models on phones, tablets, laptops. But without NVidia.
NVidia's bubble is about vastly overcharging for a thing that only they can provide. Their GPU chips have enormous margins relative to CPU chips coming out of the same/similar machines. That's a bubble. As soon as you introduce competition, the companies with the best price performance wins. NVidia is still pretty good at what they do. But not enough to justify an order of magnitude price/cost difference.
NVidia's success has been predicated on its proprietary software and instruction set (CUDA). That's a moat that won't last. The reason Google can use its own TPUs rather than CUDA is that it worked hard to get rid of their CUDA dependence. Same for the other hyperscalars. At this point they can do training and inference without CUDA/NVidia and its more cost effective.
The reason that this 100B deal is apparently being reconsidered is that it is a bad deal for OpenAI. It was going to overpay for a solution that they can get cheaper elsewhere. It's bad news for NVidia, good news for OpenAI. This deal started out with just NVidia. But at this point there are also deals with AMD, MS, and others. OpenAI like the other hyperscalers is not betting the company on NVidia/CUDA. Good for them.
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#217Earlier quoted context omitted.
Altman is a consummate liar and manipulator with no moral scruples. I think this LLM business is ethically compromised from the start, but Dario is easily the least worst of the three.
There’s 4 though, where does Demis fit in the stack rank?
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#218Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think there are two things that happened 1. OpenAI bet largely on consumer. Consumers have mostly rejected AI. And in a lot of cases even hate it (can't go on TikTok or Reddit without people calling something slop, or hating on AI generated content). Anthropic on the other hand went all in on B2B and coding. That seems to be the much better market to be in. 2. Sam Altman is profoundly unlikable.
> Consumers have mostly rejected AI. People like to complain about things, but consumers are heavily using AI. ChatGPT.com is now up to the 4th most visited website in the world: https://explodingtopics.com/blog/chatgpt-users
The difference there is it became hated after it was established and financially successful. If you need to turn free visitors in to paying customers, that general mood of “AI is bad and going to make me lose my job/fuck up society” is yet another hurdle OpenAI will have to overcome.
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#219the biggest imo indicator that it is gonna pop was dram makers not promising to expand production
Re: The $100B megadeal between OpenAI and Nvidia is on ice
#220Earlier quoted context omitted.
this is the argument i continue to have with people. first mover isnt always an advantage - i think openai will be sold or pennies on these dollars someday (next 5 years after they run out of funding). Google has data, TPUs, and a shitload of cash to burn
>first mover isnt always an advantage but in this case it is, ChatGPT name is really, really strong, it's like "just google it" instead of "just search the web"