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ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

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Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#211

Post by Buttons840 »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #192
vjvjvjvjghv wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"passing on such savings to consumers" Absolutely not. They inflate prices by 200% and then give you 20% "savings" back. The whole idea of a health insurance company as publicly traded corporation is totally insane. They are designed to extract maximum profit from wherever they can get. The is no incentive to save money for patients. Any savings go to shareholders.

There are plenty of health insurers that are not publicly traded, and in fact are non profit, and yet they have the same premiums as the publicly traded ones. See Kaiser, Providence, Cambia, Regence, and the dozens of other BCBS affiliated plans. If your claims were true, then the publicly traded businesses would have no customers.

> There are plenty of health insurers

Yeah. And they all ultimately have to be paid by my health premiums.

When I visit my parents, and they have the TV on, and I see 3 90-second advertisments for prescription drugs every single commercial break, I remind myself that, no matter what, we have to keep funding these commercials. Whatever the US decides to do for healthcare, I guarantee these commercials will continue to be paid for.

I also guarantee that pharmacy company executives, and insurance company executives will continue to make millions of dollars a year. We have to keep paying them as well.

The huge bureaucracy of insurance workers who decide what is and isn't approved, that all will have to be paid for as well.

I used to work for a company that did background checks on doctors, we had different customers in every state, every state had their own companies and their own system for maintaining and verifying doctors licenses. These different companies in each state have to be paid. I made good money as a programmer doing background checks for these various companies and my paycheck also ultimately came from your medical premiums.

I think we need to stop and appreciate the patriotic duty we all have to pay high premiums and medical costs, because every time we do we're propping up a huge portion of US workers. -- Just kidding. The truth is a lot of companies need to go out of business before things get cheaper.

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#212

Post by Aurornis »

Flatterer3544 wrote: post #80
simianwords wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain the exact way in which this is possible? It’s not legal to be denied jobs based on health. Not to deny insurance

And how would you know what they base their hiring upon? You would just get a generic automated response.. You would not be privy to their internal processes, and thusfar not be able to prove wrong doing. You would just have to hope for a new Snowden and that the found wrongdoings would actually be punished this time.

This fails the classic conspiracy theory test: Any company practicing this would have to be large enough to be able to afford to orchestrate a chain of illegal transactions to get the data, develop a process for using it in hiring, and routinely act upon it.

The continued secrecy of the conspiracy would then depend on every person involved in orchestrating this privacy violation and illegal hiring scheme keeping it secret forever. Nobody ever leaking it to the press, no disgruntled employees e-mailing their congress people, no concerned citizens slipping a screenshot to journalists. Both during and after their employment with the company.

To even make this profitable at all, the data would have to be secretly sold to a lot of companies for this use, and also continuously updated to be relevant. Giant databases of your secret ChatGPT queries being sold continuously in volume, with all employees at both the sellers, the buyers, and the users of this information all keeping it perfectly quiet, never leaking anything.

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#213

Post by Aurornis »

simianwords wrote: post #85
Flatterer3544 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how would you know what they base their hiring upon? You would just get a generic automated response.. You would not be privy to their internal processes, and thusfar not be able to prove wrong doing. You would just have to hope for a new Snowden and that the found wrongdoings would actually be punished this time.

Do corporations use my google searches as data to hire me?

I'm kind of amazed that so many people in this comment section believe their Google searches and ChatGPT conversations are being sold and used.

Under this conspiracy theory they'd have to be available for sale somewhere, right? Yet no journalist has ever picked up the story? Nobody has ever come out and whistleblown that their company was buying Google searches and denying applicants for searching for naughty words?

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#214

Post by Aurornis »

anal_reactor wrote: post #102
simianwords wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do corporations use my google searches as data to hire me?

Not yet. But Google itself would ask you for your resume if you happened to search for a lot of things related to programming.

"Ask you for your resume" is a funny way of saying "Show an advertisement to invite people to apply for a job"

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#215

Post by Workaccount2 »

ImPostingOnHN wrote: post #199
Workaccount2 wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You said enrolling in insurance was a choice. If everyone with a BMI under 22 who did at least an hour of cardio a week had their own health insurance club, they would be doing excellent with cheap premiums and great care, while everyone else drowned in medical debt as their plans collapsed. The choice right now is all or nothing. There is no choice for healthy people to only share a plan with other healthy people. I…

I am still having trouble understand how that pertains to the post to which it replied. Here are those 2 points again: 1. In the US, enrolling in health insurance is currently a choice (I'm can't tell whether your hypothesis about healthy people is agreeing or disagreeing with this point). 2. We don't want Billy to be screwed for life just because he was born to a suboptimal combination of parents. Would you mind cla…

1. I'm saying the choice is faux. Healthy people will have dramatically lower medical bills throughout their life, so why shouldn't they get discounted health insurance? Which leads to your second point which I already addressed in my initial post:

2. >This is why there is a hyperfixation on shifting blame away from (failing) individuals. The logic breaks when Billy has to admit he just hates exercising.

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#216

Post by bossyTeacher »

bwb wrote: post #12

ChatGPT has made a material difference in my ability to understand health problems, test results, and to communicate with doctors effectively. My wife and I were talking last night about how helpful it was in 2025. I hope that it continues to be good at this. I want regulators to keep an eye on this and make smart laws. I don't want it to go away, as its value is massive in my life. (One example, if you are curious:…

>my ability to understand health problems

How do you know that this understanding is correct? To me, epistemologically, this is not too different from gaining your health knowledge from a homeopath or gaining your physics knowledge from a Flat Earther. You are in no position to discern the validity of your "knowledge".

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#217

Post by avalys »

kyboren wrote: post #173
avalys wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? If the only factors allowed to be used in settings premiums are age, location and smoking status, then those are the only parameters that could be input to an AI model, no?

Warning: I am not in this industry and the below is speculation: AIUI the idea is to predict the "correct" price for an individual premium, Y, which is restricted to being the result of some insurance model function, f(), that is itself restricted to the domain of age (A), location (L), and smoking status (S): Y = f(A, L, S) My impression was that the idea was that this would handicap insurers' natural desire to pric…

That’s not how courts and laws work. If you cheat and use other illegal factors to compute a premium for each person, and then create an AI model that effectively looks up your illegally calculated premium of each person by their location, they’re going to reach the obvious conclusion - you are calculating a premium using illegal factors.

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#218

Post by bossyTeacher »

linkregister wrote: post #170
well_ackshually wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any proof they don't? Do you have any proof the "AI System" that they use to filter out candidates doesn't "accidentally" access data ? Are you willing to bet that Google, OpenAI, Anthropic, Meta, won't sell access to that information? Also, in some cases: they absolutely do. Try to get hired in Palantir and see how much they know about your browsing history. Anything related to national security or requi…

The last time I went through the Palantir hiring process, the effort on their end was almost exclusively on technical and cultural fit interviews. My references told me they had not been contacted. Calibrating your threat model against this attack is unlikely to give you any alpha in 2026. Hiring at tech companies and government is much less deliberate than your mental model supposes. The current extent of background…

>the effort on their end was almost exclusively on technical and cultural fit interviews

How could you possibly know if they use other undisclosed methods as part of the recruitment? You are assuming Palatir would behave ethically. Palantir, the company that will never win awards based on ethics

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#219

Post by beepbopboopp »

trollbridge wrote: post #18
bwb wrote: post #12

ChatGPT has made a material difference in my ability to understand health problems, test results, and to communicate with doctors effectively. My wife and I were talking last night about how helpful it was in 2025. I hope that it continues to be good at this. I want regulators to keep an eye on this and make smart laws. I don't want it to go away, as its value is massive in my life. (One example, if you are curious:…

This sounds like excellent evidentiary material for a future insurer or government health provider to decide you're uninsurable, not eligible for a job, and so on. And the great thing about it is that you already signed all your rights away for them to do this exact thing , when we could have had an open world with open models run locally instead where you got to keep your private health information private.

This is an argument against the general data collection internet NOT chatGPT.

Re: ChatGPT Health is a marketplace, guess who is the product?

#220

Post by zemvpferreira »

bossyTeacher wrote: post #216
bwb wrote: post #12

ChatGPT has made a material difference in my ability to understand health problems, test results, and to communicate with doctors effectively. My wife and I were talking last night about how helpful it was in 2025. I hope that it continues to be good at this. I want regulators to keep an eye on this and make smart laws. I don't want it to go away, as its value is massive in my life. (One example, if you are curious:…

>my ability to understand health problems How do you know that this understanding is correct? To me, epistemologically, this is not too different from gaining your health knowledge from a homeopath or gaining your physics knowledge from a Flat Earther. You are in no position to discern the validity of your "knowledge".

It's a lot easier to double-check, cross-reference, or test the validity of advice given by a gpt. It has no authority, no persuasion mechanisms, and its opinions are there in plain text ready to be picked apart. You can ask it for references and non-confrontationally challenge it on the things you're sceptical about. It generally avoids woo in my experience though it's hardly always correct in specific advice, it can definitely point you in productive directions. Which is completely different from discussing anything health with a homeopath, who at best will try to get you to avoid productive treatment and at worst poison you.
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