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What if tariffs?

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Re: What if tariffs?

#211

Post by sneak »

johnnyanmac wrote: post #210
sneak wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So someone gets to arbitrarily decide what is or isn’t true, and thus arbitrarily remove anyone from any office for life? Sounds like a foolproof plan. Did we not read 1984?

That's how it works right now. Besides Trump, the US's last presidental impeachment was over a sex scandal. They "say" it was because he lied about it, but I think we know better at this point. It's just really hard to impeach because you need 66 or 67 of the Senate to agree on something, not the usual 51. But yes, we'd need some truly neutral Ombudsmen to back up such a system. And they themselves would need to be a…

Cheating on your wife isn’t a crime.

Perjury is.

Re: What if tariffs?

#212

Post by johnnyanmac »

lukan wrote: post #148
spiderfarmer wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you attacking a point he didn't make? Trump lies. Almost every sentence is a lie. If you're allowed to lie during your campaign and you're immune from the repercussions, of course you're going to sway voters. Don't close your eyes to obvious truths.

"Why are you attacking a point he didn't make?" Because I missunderstood. "If you're allowed to lie during your campaign and you're immune from the repercussions, of course you're going to sway voters" But in my world, lying is enough to not vote for them anyway.

Sadly a lie travels the world by the time the truth can put on its pants. If Trump did rig any polls, we're still here a year in just trying to get such a court case off the ground. And that year was more than enough to do decades worth of damage.

Re: What if tariffs?

#213

Post by johnnyanmac »

sneak wrote: post #211
johnnyanmac wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's how it works right now. Besides Trump, the US's last presidental impeachment was over a sex scandal. They "say" it was because he lied about it, but I think we know better at this point. It's just really hard to impeach because you need 66 or 67 of the Senate to agree on something, not the usual 51. But yes, we'd need some truly neutral Ombudsmen to back up such a system. And they themselves would need to be a…

Cheating on your wife isn’t a crime. Perjury is.

Yeah, use loopholes to get what you want. This year has taught me that well.

Re: What if tariffs?

#214

Post by jibal »

mbrumlow wrote: post #200
intermerda wrote: post #9

The number 39 refers to the 39% tariff rate on Switzerland. Kind of insane that the American President just made up a lie that tariffs are paid by foreign countries and rest of the administration just went along with it. It flies in the face of any common sense.

So why would the Swiss company care then? Care so much to make a special watch? It’s no skin off their back, they don’t pay the tariff right? Americans are the only ones affected right?

People buy less when the price goes up.

Re: What if tariffs?

#215

Post by johnnyanmac »

bootsmann wrote: post #61
nicois wrote: post #21

This would be more impactful if we could see the cost to US purchasers was actually 39% more. Sadly some manufacturers spread the cost across all consumers, which actually means non-US customers are actually paying some of the tariff costs too.

This was a big worry initially when the tariffs were announced but it doesn’t actually seem to be happening. Most manufacturers are not adjusting their price structure because the effects are super hard to estimate (don’t forget that the US is still just 20% of worldwide demand)

The gaming market is a good example of how they tried to mitigate this. Firstly, Nintendo tried to not surge the price of the Switch 2 by instead increasing the prices of accessories. Then they raised Switch 1 prices. It might still end up needing to raise the Switch 2 price if this keeps up.

Sony and Microsoft did price hikes outside of the US at first as an example of how other countries may be paying for US tarriffs indirectly. But as of a month ago these had to relent and eventually they did both do price hikes on their systems.

Re: What if tariffs?

#216

Post by jibal »

burnerRhodov2 wrote: post #205
dieortin wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It obviously affects Swiss companies too, because their products become more expensive to American consumers, which makes it more unlikely they will buy them. No one said Americans are the only ones affected. But it’s Americans that pay the tariffs.

if i charge a 39% tarrif on swiss watches, doesn't that make american watches 39% more competitive? So, people will just buy more american watches in your example, no?

The question they were answering is why would a Swiss company care.

Re: What if tariffs?

#217

Post by throwaway173738 »

jakewins wrote: post #58
exe34 wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The exporter gets paid the same as before. The buyer pays more. There's a subtle difference, can you spot it?

This isn’t actually how it works though. Who pays the tariff is the same as who pays a tax: it depends on the price elasticity of supply and demand. If the demand curve is very price sensitive - like people might stop buying wool blankets if the price went up 50%, and buy cotton blankets instead - then the tariff will be paid by the suppliers, because they must lower their prices to make the final price the same. And…

> If the demand curve is very price sensitive - like people might stop buying wool blankets if the price went up 50%, and buy cotton blankets instead - then the tariff will be paid by the suppliers, because they must lower their prices to make the final price the same.

And the people buying cotton blankets are materially worse off than they were before the tariffs were imposed. They have to accept an inferior product until the wool supplier’s prices have adjusted. Or the wool supplier folds and not nobody can buy wool blankets anymore.

Re: What if tariffs?

#218

Post by Tiktaalik »

sojournerc wrote: post #110
hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #99

It’s actually quite shocking to leave the U.S. and experience the drastic fall in respect. The U.S. has over a century’s worth of dominance and control built in, so it’s not gonna unravel anytime soon and countries will need to grovel along for a bit. But the decoupling has begun, is almost certainly irreversible and is gonna hit Americans hard at most a decade from now. We have no idea the the chain of motion that h…

I'm not sure it's all that new. During the Bush Jr. years America was not highly thought of. I'm an American traveling through Scandinavia and Northern continental Europe for the last three weeks, now in the UK. I haven't experienced a bit of grief. Their opinion of our politics is generally separate from how they treat me personally, and I do the same for people of other nationalities. American cultural dominance is…

There's no comparison to the W Bush years. He was a buffoon that was mocked, but few if any seriously did things like boycott travel to the USA. Now boycotting travel to the USA is commonplace and travel to the USA has plunged.

People are nice and will continue to be nice to nice American tourists but make no mistake, there has been a severe shift both in the actions of regular people and business.

Re: What if tariffs?

#219

Post by jibal »

delusional wrote: post #133
Ekaros wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish there was simple three strike policy on any elected official. Three proven lies and they are remove from office for life. And these can be anything. And not knowing at time does not change it. Only silence or absolute truth should be accepted.

"absolute truth" doesn't exist. I understand what you're saying, but the question of when a lie should then disqualify you from office must itself be a political question.

Absolute truth exists, and a claim that it doesn't is self-contradictory. The difficulty is in determining what is or isn't true, especially for empirical matters. (In math and logic the difficulty can vary. And some statements are true by definition, e.g., all unmarried men are bachelors.)

Re: What if tariffs?

#220

Post by Tiktaalik »

CoastalCoder wrote: post #109
hshdhdhj4444 wrote: post #99

It’s actually quite shocking to leave the U.S. and experience the drastic fall in respect. The U.S. has over a century’s worth of dominance and control built in, so it’s not gonna unravel anytime soon and countries will need to grovel along for a bit. But the decoupling has begun, is almost certainly irreversible and is gonna hit Americans hard at most a decade from now. We have no idea the the chain of motion that h…

> It’s actually quite shocking to leave the U.S. and experience the drastic fall in respect. My only vantage point is from inside the U.S., but I find the loss of prestige completely believable. What amazed me was discovering that my own countrymen would vote in, and continue to support, someone like Trump. My political views are pretty centrist, and I thought I understood the views of most liberals and conservatives…

This is what happens in a FPTP two party system.

If you don't like one party what other option do you have but to vote for the other party?

So as a result it's enormously easy for radicals to take over a big tent party and still achieve remarkable support.

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