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A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

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Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#211

Post by Brajeshwar »

GavinAnderegg wrote: post #144

14kB is a stretch goal, though trying to stick to the first 10 packets is a cool idea. A project I like that focuses on page size is 512kb.club [1] which is like a golf score for your site’s page size. My site [2] came in just over 71k when I measured before getting added (for all assets). This project also introduced me to Cloudflare Radar [3] which includes a great tool for site analysis/page sizing, but is mainly…

512kb is pretty achievable for personal websites. My next target is to stay within 99kb (100kb as the ceiling). Should be pretty trivial on a few weekends. My website is in the Orange on 512kb.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#212

Post by Henchman21 »

the_real_cher wrote: post #133
samrus wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The decision to use react for the start menu wasnt out of competency. The guy said on twitter that thats what he knew so he used it [1]. Didnt think twice. Head empty no thoughts 1 https://x.com/philtrem22/status/1927161666732523596

Fair warning, X has has more trolls than 4chan.

Please, it has more trolls than Middle Earth

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#213

Post by AnotherGoodName »

susam wrote: post #173
welpo wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That said, I do use KaTeX with client-side rendering on a limited number of pages that have mathematical content You could try replacing KaTeX with MathML: https://w3c.github.io/mathml-core/

> You could try replacing KaTeX with MathML: https://w3c.github.io/mathml-core/ I would love to use MathML, not directly, but automatically generated from LaTeX, since I find LaTeX much easier to work with than MathML. I mean, while I am writing a mathematical post, I'd much rather write LaTeX (which is almost muscle memory for me), than write MathML (which often tends to get deeply nested and tedious to write). Howe…

Math expressions are like regex to me nowadays. I ask the llm coding assistant to write it and it’s very very good at it. I’ll probably forget the syntax soon but no big deal.

“MathML for {very rough textual form of the equation}” seems to give a 100% hit rate for me. Even when i want some formatting change i can ask the llm and that pretty much always has a solution (mathml can render symbols and subscripts in numerous ways but the syntax is deep). It’ll even add the css needed to change it up in some way if asked.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#214

Post by firecall »

Alifatisk wrote: post #100
ghoshbishakh wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

rails has nothing to do with the rendered page size though. Congrats on the perfect lighthouse score.

Doesn't Rails asset pipeline have an effect on the page size, like if Propshaft being used instead of Sprockets. From what I remember, Propshaft intentionally does not include minification or compression.

It’s all Rails 8 + Turbo + Stimulus JS with Propshaft handling the asset bundling / pipeline.

All the Tailwind building and so on is done using common JS tools, which are mostly standard out of the box Rails 8 supplied scripts!

Sprockets used to do the SASS compilation and asset bundling, but the Rails standard now is to facilitate your own preferences around compilation of CSS/JS.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#215

Post by bobmcnamara »

mr_toad wrote: post #166
anymouse123456 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This idea that performance is irrelevant gets under my skin. It's how we ended up with Docker and Kubernetes and the absolute slop stack that is destroying everything it touches. Performance matters. We've spent so many decades misinterpreting Knuth's quote about optimization that we've managed to chew up 5-6 orders of magnitude in hardware performance gains and still deliver slow, bloated and defective software prod…

Containers were invented because VMs were too slow to cold start and used too much memory. Their whole raison d'être is performance.

Can you live fork containers like you can VMs?

VM clone time is surprisingly quick once you stop copying memory, after that it's mostly ejecting the NIC and bringing up the new one.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#216

Post by mort96 »

ldjb wrote: post #116
samrus wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The decision to use react for the start menu wasnt out of competency. The guy said on twitter that thats what he knew so he used it [1]. Didnt think twice. Head empty no thoughts 1 https://x.com/philtrem22/status/1927161666732523596

Please do share any evidence to the contrary, but it seems that the Tweet is not serious and is not from someone who worked on the Start Menu.

I found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMJNEFHj8b8&t=287s

I googled the names of the people holding the talk and they're both employed by Microsoft as software engineers, I don't see any reason to doubt what they're presenting. Not the whole start menu is React Native, but parts are.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#217

Post by mort96 »

bobmcnamara wrote: post #215
mr_toad wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Containers were invented because VMs were too slow to cold start and used too much memory. Their whole raison d'être is performance.

Can you live fork containers like you can VMs? VM clone time is surprisingly quick once you stop copying memory, after that it's mostly ejecting the NIC and bringing up the new one.

I can't say I've ever cared about live forking a container (or VM, for that matter)

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#218

Post by sgarland »

jeroenhd wrote: post #157
9dev wrote: post #7

The overlap of people that don’t know what TCP Slow Start is and those that should care about their website loading a few milliseconds faster is incredibly small. A startup should focus on, well, starting up, not performance; a corporation large enough to optimise speed on that level will have a team of experienced SREs that know over which detail to obsess.

When your approach is "I don't care because I have more important things to focus on", you never care. There's always something you can do that's more important to a company than optimising the page load to align with the TCP window size used to access your server. This is why almost all applications and websites are slow and terrible these days.

This. A million times this.

Performance isn’t seen as sexy, for reasons I don’t understand. Devs will be agog about how McMaster-Carr manages to make a usable and incredibly fast site, but they don’t put that same energy back into their own work.

People like responsive applications - you can’t tell me you’ve never seen a non-tech person frustratingly tapping their screen repeatedly because something is slow.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#219

Post by sgarland »

9dev wrote: post #7

The overlap of people that don’t know what TCP Slow Start is and those that should care about their website loading a few milliseconds faster is incredibly small. A startup should focus on, well, starting up, not performance; a corporation large enough to optimise speed on that level will have a team of experienced SREs that know over which detail to obsess.

Depending on the physical distance, it can be much more than a few msec, as TFA discusses.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#220

Post by 3cats-in-a-coat »

MrJohz wrote: post #164
3cats-in-a-coat wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is about your "plain HTML". If the rest is in cache, then TCP concerns are irrelevant.

Depending on who's visiting your site and how often, the rest probably isn't in cache though. If your site is a product landing page or a small blog or something else that people are rarely going to repeatedly visit, then it's probably best to assume that all your assets will need to be downloaded most of the time.

While it'd be fun to try, I doubt you can produce any page at all that's total 14kb with assets, even back at the dawn of the web in the 90s, aside from the spartan minimal academic pages some have. And where loading faster is completely irrelevant.
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