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Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

arstechnica.com

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Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#211

Post by supertrope »

sometimes_all wrote: post #49

I understand the need for independent fiber ISPs. But are gigabit speeds really necessary? For me, a 300 Mbps connection is way more than enough for a four-person family.

It's usually the upload speeds that are the bottleneck. When the upload is only 10 Mbps any video upload or large file upload will saturate the connection. In addition to having to wait for the video to finish uploading, if you don't manually rate limit the upload job speed or have anti-bufferbloat measures deployed any concurrent voice or video calls will suffer. During Covid shutdowns four people video chatting at once was no longer far fetched.

The scarcity of upload speed is why I learned how to setup OpenWrt's SQM feature, and upgraded to the highest package my ISPs offers.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#212

Post by supertrope »

simoncion wrote: post #148
sometimes_all wrote: post #49

I understand the need for independent fiber ISPs. But are gigabit speeds really necessary? For me, a 300 Mbps connection is way more than enough for a four-person family.

> But are gigabit speeds really necessary? For me, a 300 Mbps connection is way more than enough for a four-person family. I'm certain that one could make a sound argument that 300 Mbps is not necessary for that four-person family, and they could make do with a much slower connection. Back in the day, folks would be asking if it's necessary for your Internet connection to be always on. After all, it's no hassle at al…

Low upload speed is like a house with only one bathroom.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#213

Post by Spivak »

amethyst wrote: post #89
PantaloonFlames wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sorry I still don’t get it. Could you explain that in different phrasing ? A comcast customer always had the option to pay for unlimited data. I get that part. What is the 2nd part? “Started offering it as standard” means what?

In markets where Comcast has actual real competition, they "include" the unlimited data (aka no cap) with no extra charge when you sign up for their gigabit plans.

You pay for their highest tiered and highest bandwidth plan and they have the audacity to impose a cap making that bandwidth work against you? Crazy. My household internet usage is quite modest, nothing anyone on HN would call data intensive—casual video streaming being the lion's share, and I blow out 1TB every month without fail.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#214

Post by fuckinpuppers »

gs17 wrote: post #26
nancyminusone wrote: post #19

I'm one of their customers. I often see that one green car parked down the road. It's pretty good - their provided router is locked down to hell and they're on a cgnat, but not having to deal with Comcast's 1.2tb data cap is well worth it. Checking Comcast's site now, it seems that they now offer "unlimited" data. Interesting, that option wasn't there 6 months ago. ~100 customers seems too small for the amount of eff…

> Checking Comcast's site now, it seems that they now offer "unlimited" data. Interesting, that option wasn't there 6 months ago. It's been there since they announced the data cap. I thought the unlimited bundled with leasing their higher end hardware came first, but the email from 2016 announcing that our plan was getting the cap mentions being able to pay for unlimited.

Yeah they’ve offered unlimited for a few years now for an additional charge. Now as of last month all plans are unlimited if you just update to them. It wound up being cheaper for me too.

However I still applaud these guys. There needs to be more competition.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#215

Post by sometimes_all »

supertrope wrote: post #211
sometimes_all wrote: post #49

I understand the need for independent fiber ISPs. But are gigabit speeds really necessary? For me, a 300 Mbps connection is way more than enough for a four-person family.

It's usually the upload speeds that are the bottleneck. When the upload is only 10 Mbps any video upload or large file upload will saturate the connection. In addition to having to wait for the video to finish uploading, if you don't manually rate limit the upload job speed or have anti-bufferbloat measures deployed any concurrent voice or video calls will suffer. During Covid shutdowns four people video chatting at…

Interesting. Yes, I guess the upload speed definitely matters, which cable/DSL don't provide.

I myself have fiber, and speeds are much less than 500 Mbps, but symmetric (with likely maximum two people using video calling at a time), so haven't faced that issue.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#216

Post by beeb »

sleepydog wrote: post #53
beeb wrote: post #43

Wow the US really has it bad when it comes to home internet. In many European countries, you can get symmetric Gbit internet for 30-40 EUR (probably less in some places), and I haven't seen a data cap in forever.

The EU is better on average, but isn't universally great either. I pay 60 EUR for 200Mbit down/20Mbit up ADSL in Amsterdam, after my 6-month discount ran out. No fiber in my neighborhood yet. There's one gigabit provider in my neighborhood (Ziggo) and they have a bad reputation. For the same price I was getting FiOS gigabit in NYC.

That's crazy, 200M asymmetric for 60 EUR is robbery.

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#217

Post by beeb »

jkl12 wrote: post #131
beeb wrote: post #43

Wow the US really has it bad when it comes to home internet. In many European countries, you can get symmetric Gbit internet for 30-40 EUR (probably less in some places), and I haven't seen a data cap in forever.

Would it make you jealous if I tell you, that I get 10 Gbit symmetric fiber here in Switzerland (greater Zurich area) for roughly 80 USD/month with no data cap? And I can use my own router and could even go up to 25 Gbit if I want ;-) Oh, and did I mention no CGNAT and it comes with a static /48 IPv6 net?

Not really, I also live in Switzerland and would have access to equivalent plans where I live :P

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#218

Post by [deleted] »

kjellsbells wrote: post #168
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me, no IPv6 = no business. I don't think it's acceptable to build a network on IPv4 only at this point, it speaks to being willing to cut corners and not do things the right way just because it's easier.

I worked in this space for a while, in the US. Outside of the major cities, Internet service falls off extremely quickly. Like, shockingly so: you can be as close as fifty miles from, say Philly or Flagstaff and have zero fiber, zero cell coverage, just nothing. The people who attempt to fill these gaps are commonly rural telephone companies, electric cooperatives, tribal entities, or mom and pop shops where the owne…

[deleted]

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#219

Post by throw0101b »

mschuster91 wrote: post #51
WarOnPrivacy wrote: post #25

"Everything that we're doing is all underground." This indicates that their local and state governments aren't (at this time) captured by the incumbent cable provider. A captured state gov will pass laws to thwart new infra deployment, commonly written by ISP interests. A captured local gov will never approve deployment or slow-walk permitting in an attempt to bankrupt the upstart. more explainers: New suburban fiber…

It's not that easy. Poles vs trenches are a tradeoff discussion. FWIW I was once in construction digging trenches and I'm German, so I might be biased a bit. Pro poles / open air: - very, VERY cheap and fast to build out with GPON. That's how you got 1/1 GBit fiber in some piss poor village in the rural ditches of Romania. - easy to get access when you need to do maintenance Con poles / open air: - it looks fucking u…

> […] or moronic cable thieves to access and damage infrastructure

Manufacturers should print on the sleeve "fibre optic only. no copper". :)

> [Buried pros:] Drunk drivers are no concern, and so are cable thieves or terrorists.

Except for that one old lady who took the country of Armenia off the air:

* https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/apr/06/georgian-woman...

Re: Two guys hated using Comcast, so they built their own fiber ISP

#220

Post by nulbyte »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #204
nulbyte wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tailscale uses the same range as CGNAT. https://github.com/tailscale/tailscale/issues/12829

You shouldn't be seeing the CGNAT addresses inside your home network, should you?

Depends on your network, router configuration. But in any case, if you install it on a router where the upstream uses CGNAT yes, you would.
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