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Figma files for proposed IPO

figma.com

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Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#211
post #10

They don't link to the Form S-1 prospectus from their announcement, but it's publicly available at https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1579878/000162828025... Their highlighted metrics page: $821M LTM revenue, 46% YoY revenue growth, 18% non-GAAP operating margin, 91% gross margin. It's an incredible success story, and the engineering they did upfront (primarily led by co-founder Evan Wallace) that set the stage…

RE: the webgl being used to render a site thing - I'd always thought this should be done so that we can use a nice, clean grid co-ord system same as iOS/Android, etc.

None of this "designed for newspaper print" style layout. Yes, I know flexbox is very good. But it's still a hack (imo).

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#212

A bit off-topic, but I really wish we had a system where we could make bets to pit public companies that develop closed source software against its FOSS alternatives. In the example here: people would bet by either buying $100 worth of Figma shares, or they could buy $50 worth of put options and give $50 to the developers of Penpot. Would something like that be legal or does it violate any type of trading regulations…

Don't we have that system? Post IPO you can absolutely buy puts on FIG while donating to Penpot.

(I do not recommend this)

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That generally makes me more inclined to invest as I find that the biggest problem with a lot of public companies is they manage to Wall Street which means putting the short term over the long term, and those are often at odds with each other.

Short term focus is not a control issue it's a fact of life with public ownership. They still need to manage to market expectations or they will be punished, now one person can do whatever it takes to stay focused on only the next 2 quarters.

It’s not really punishment if you don’t care what your share price is. A lower share price doesn’t hurt a company unless perhaps they are trying to do a secondary offering or something.

It does, however, hurt the Wall Street investors. If they have enough power to do so, they will replace the CEO if a share price is too low for too long.

That’s what creates the short term incentive that is a trouble and a lot of public companies. If the CEO has control of the voting shares, that pressure is relieved.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That generally makes me more inclined to invest as I find that the biggest problem with a lot of public companies is they manage to Wall Street which means putting the short term over the long term, and those are often at odds with each other.

There are a whole lot of companies that are run to benefit their management and not their shareholders. At best, they might be making no money but keeping a bunch of people in work. There's a good reason public shareholders historically demanded accountability - maybe it's fine for now, but all it takes is some management that you can't kick out, paying themselves extortionate salaries and driving the company into th…

There are certainly downsides to it, but you’ll notice that most of the biggest companies of the last 20 years had a dual class stock structure that gives the founders a high level of control.

The most efficient government is a benevolent dictatorship, the problem, of course is that benevolent dictators don’t live forever and sooner or later you get a non-benevolent one.

These sorts of dual class share structures avoid that issue by generally becoming common stock on transfer so it turns into a democracy with the end of the dictator.

With an IPO you at least got to spend several years seeing how the dictator did.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#215

A bit off-topic, but I really wish we had a system where we could make bets to pit public companies that develop closed source software against its FOSS alternatives. In the example here: people would bet by either buying $100 worth of Figma shares, or they could buy $50 worth of put options and give $50 to the developers of Penpot. Would something like that be legal or does it violate any type of trading regulations…

Don't we have that system? Post IPO you can absolutely buy puts on FIG while donating to Penpot. (I do not recommend this)

Doing that as separate actions are of course possible. My idea is to have a system to let people do this and track the results in a single place.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#216
Congratulations to the Figma team! Well earned. It was such an exciting product when it hit the scene. It became the standard so fast, and it was easy to see why. When there were talks of them being bought for $20 billion I thought it was a great deal for Adobe - and that was before seeing these impressive financials.

I will admit I have waned enthusiasm a on Figma over the past couple of years. I find the UI churn confusing. The new features, i.e. dev mode and variables, feel out of place. I find the plugin ecosystem cumbersome. Doing simple things has become complex. I'm putting out real "who moved my cheese?" energy here I know. I suppose I'm wondering if others feel the same.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#217
post #204
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And for anyone who’s going to say “Sketch was Mac only that’s why it failed!” Why would anyone say that? Sketch is still alive and (presumably) well. Apple themselves continue to officially release design files for Sketch with every OS release. They share more resources for Sketch than any other app, including Figma and Photoshop. http://developer.apple.com/design/resources/ > after they depreciated Fireworks I’ve…

People say it all of the time. Go onto any other platform discussing this topic and you'll see it as the most cited reason for Figma's dominance. Yes, Sketch's logo has been featured in a Apple keynote before. I'm familiar with their relationship with Apple and it seems like their team is perfectly happy not being the gargantuan that Figma is. Sometimes I feel like people just want to find any reason to disagree on h…

Of course we would say that, with the exception of my current employer, and I am approaching 50 years, no one else has used Apple gear on the office, designers working at my previous employers had to put up with Windows if they wanted a job, and I can vouch we always had plenty of candidates looking for one.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#218
post #207
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was one of their first Enterprise customers way back in 2017’ish-give-or-take. The brilliance of the system he built was that it allowed for real time collaboration. Which was god send from the Sketch -> Zeplin -> Invision -> Avocode (version management) ‘stack’ that lost Enterprise design orgs were using. Which was already a large leap from what Adobe was expecting us to do with Photoshop/Illustrator (after they d…

> It wasn’t lost on us that Sketch is/was much much smoother with its usage of Mac OS’s native shape rendering. Writing this from the perspective of someone who used to spend all day every day in Photoshop/Sketch/Figma for decades. This markedly contradicts my recollection of the state of Sketch at the time Figma was in its first public beta. Sketch's performance was abhorrent and it was constantly crashing while wor…

There's definitely others that shared your perspective. A commonly cited reason of early Figma adopters was that they felt it was faster than Sketch.

Of course, the reality was that performance is a super nuanced thing. It's always measured in relation to specific things, but ultimately summarized via a "feeling".

Aspects of performance include:

- Loading a (blank/medium/large) file from (scratch/cache/etc)

- Performance when editing (what?), panning, zooming (small or large doc?)

- Performance with a large number of simple objects, or complex objects (components? variables? nested components? drop shadows/background blurs?)

I haven't personally done some performance comparisons between the two apps since ~2018 but at the time there were definitely things where Figma was noticeably faster than sketch, a lot of things that were comparable, some things that were slower. My own very biased feeling was that Figma was faster more often than not but it's always up to the individual use case, how their file is setup, what they are doing within that file, and how they mentally weigh those different scenarios.

I definitely didn't feel like being on the web was a limiting factor. In some theoretical state, with infinite resources to optimize everything, native could be faster since you have access to lower-level APIs. In practice, that's the same argument as "it could be faster in hand-written assembly". Almost never did we get to the point where we'd use those abilities even if we had them, due to their cost on development and impact on the correctness/maintainability of the code.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#219
post #10

They don't link to the Form S-1 prospectus from their announcement, but it's publicly available at https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1579878/000162828025... Their highlighted metrics page: $821M LTM revenue, 46% YoY revenue growth, 18% non-GAAP operating margin, 91% gross margin. It's an incredible success story, and the engineering they did upfront (primarily led by co-founder Evan Wallace) that set the stage…

While I like the product, the net income would worry me if I were to participate in the IPO. $280M net income in 2023 after they received $1B for the failed merger and $730M net loss because of RSU/Stock Awards in 2024 is not great when the total revenue for the company was $500M in 2023 and $750M in 2024.

They're about to get upstaged by AI too.

Not because they can't be leaders in the space, but because there won't be any moat.

Re: Figma files for proposed IPO

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Let it be a lesson for anyone worried that “their idea has been taken” or “there already solutions for this” out there. I have nothing but respect for Figma's tech, but I'm not really sure this lesson is generalizable to 99.9% of other people. By all accounts Evan Wallace has skills and talent the vast majority of software developers don't have and never will have. The reason Figma was able to succeed in this space…

> The reason Figma was able to succeed in this space is that their engineering team was like the 90s-era Chicago Bulls of software development. Huge contracts are built to extract as much wealth from the customer as possible without letting the victim know. Not by engineering talent. Huge contracts are what make Figma a success story.

That's such an unfair, pessimistic, and "economics-free" take. The giant enterprises with "huge contracts" as you point out are not "victims" - it's not like they're hapless newbies who don't know how enterprise contracts work. Especially in the case of Figma, where there are loads of competitive products (which was the point of the comment I was responding to), clients have plenty of other options. They chose and continue to choose Figma because they believe it gives them value over other possibilities.
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