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Zod 4

zod.dev

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Re: Zod 4

#211

Post by sureIy »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #24
causal wrote: post #5

Zod is a lot better than some of the alternative solutions I've seen. That said, the need for this sort of explicit validation always felt like a failure of where modern web development has taken us. It's so frustrating how full-stack development requires so many ways of describing the same shapes: JS input validation, Swagger for API definition, server-side input validation, ORM for schema conformance, and TypeScrip…

TypeScript's insistence on being a static checking/compile time only system is such a sad wound to the whole ecosystem. I don't want TypeScript to be a runtime checker, but I want it to export useful usable type data for classes, functions, objects. TypeScript feels like the best source of truth we have, but instead so many of the attempts to reflect on what we have are all going it alone, having to define their own…

> I don't want TypeScript to be a runtime checker

I do.

If the types are internally consistent, then they don't need runtime validation, it'd just be extra code to download and run.

If you accept external data, you may already opt in using something like Zod. I don't see why conflate the two things just because their quacks echo the same.

Re: Zod 4

#212

Post by _1tem »

As a full stack dev that runs their own SaaS with thousands of users in production, sometimes I get a very pleasant reminder of how many problems I am blissfully unaware of just because I decided not to build an SPA or use JS frontend frameworks. It never occurred to me that I need such a thing as Zod/ArkType - first time hearing of it, and I have no use for it.

It boggles my mind how much effort and complexity and tooling goes into building an SPA. Entire classes of problems simply don't exist if you choose not to build an SPA. Meanwhile, I use the browser as designed: with full page reloads, backend development only, and occasional reactivity using a backend-only framework like Laravel Livewire. Everything is so simple: from access control to validation to state management. And yes, my app is fast, reactive, modern, SEO friendly, and serves thousands of users in production.

Re: Zod 4

#213

Post by aiiizzz »

rafram wrote: post #39

> To simplify the migration process both for users and Zod's ecosystem of associated libraries, Zod 4 is being published alongside Zod 3 as part of the zod@3.25 release. [...] import Zod 4 from the "/v4" subpath npm is an absolute disaster of a dependency management system. Peer dependencies are so broken that they had to make v4 pretend it's v3.

Horrible, not going to use it now. My ide will import whichever interchangeably, and it'll be a mess

Re: Zod 4

#214

Post by giorgioz »

_1tem wrote: post #212

As a full stack dev that runs their own SaaS with thousands of users in production, sometimes I get a very pleasant reminder of how many problems I am blissfully unaware of just because I decided not to build an SPA or use JS frontend frameworks. It never occurred to me that I need such a thing as Zod/ArkType - first time hearing of it, and I have no use for it. It boggles my mind how much effort and complexity and t…

What's your SaaS? I would like to check out your use case that allowed you to build a great product without SPA.

Re: Zod 4

#215

Post by SebastianKra »

_1tem wrote: post #212

As a full stack dev that runs their own SaaS with thousands of users in production, sometimes I get a very pleasant reminder of how many problems I am blissfully unaware of just because I decided not to build an SPA or use JS frontend frameworks. It never occurred to me that I need such a thing as Zod/ArkType - first time hearing of it, and I have no use for it. It boggles my mind how much effort and complexity and t…

Well how do you do server-side validation?

Because now I have the impression that you're just defensively writing a bunch of if-statements. Or worse, you rely on html client-side form validation only.

Re: Zod 4

#217

Post by zachrip »

_1tem wrote: post #212

As a full stack dev that runs their own SaaS with thousands of users in production, sometimes I get a very pleasant reminder of how many problems I am blissfully unaware of just because I decided not to build an SPA or use JS frontend frameworks. It never occurred to me that I need such a thing as Zod/ArkType - first time hearing of it, and I have no use for it. It boggles my mind how much effort and complexity and t…

Zod has nothing to do with SPAs and isn't just a frontend tool. Do you not validate inputs in your code?

Re: Zod 4

#218

Post by IshKebab »

colinmcd wrote: post #125

Author here, AMA! Regarding the versioning: I wrote a fairly detailed writeup here[0] for those who are interested in the reasons for this approach. Ultimately npm is not designed to handle the situation Zod finds itself in. Zod is subject to a bunch of constraints that virtually no other libraries are subject to. Namely, the are dozens or hundreds of libraries that directly import interfaces/classes from Zod and use…

Uhm... Wouldn't it make more sense just to publish a `zod4` package?

Re: Zod 4

#219

Post by dimitrisnl »

_1tem wrote: post #212

As a full stack dev that runs their own SaaS with thousands of users in production, sometimes I get a very pleasant reminder of how many problems I am blissfully unaware of just because I decided not to build an SPA or use JS frontend frameworks. It never occurred to me that I need such a thing as Zod/ArkType - first time hearing of it, and I have no use for it. It boggles my mind how much effort and complexity and t…

Entire classes of problems simply don't exist, if you also close your eyes.

Re: Zod 4

#220

Post by koakuma-chan »

elanora96 wrote: post #177
koakuma-chan wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure that's not a skill issue? Zod v4 has .mdx documentation which can be given to the LLM as context, including a migration guide. A reasoning LLM should be able to manage.

I've only tried Claude in Cursor's free trial, but it became very confused during a React 19 upgrade even after showing it a guide. It also kept telling me to install irrelevant dependencies saying my code would not work without them. My experience was more or less shared with several other senior devs using their companies AI subscriptions. Are we all using the tools wrong? Or is there just an expected amount of hav…

> I've only tried Claude in Cursor's free trial, but it became very confused during a React 19 upgrade even after showing it a guide.

I have never used Cursor, but I see more and more people who used LLMs specifically via Cursor complain. It makes me think there's an issue specifically with Cursor, e.g., they try to save on tokens and end up not including enough context in the prompt.

> I've only tried Claude in Cursor's free trial, but it became very confused during a React 19 upgrade even after showing it a guide.

I am working on a Next.js 15 / React 19 app, and at least 95% of code is written by Gemini 2.5 Pro Preview, and I barely ever need to "fight" it really. But it's not a Cursor workflow of course. I keep a directory with LLM-readable documentation[0], use a repository serialization tool to serialize my repository into a prompt (this includes both the source code and the LLM-readable documentation), and send it to Gemini 2.5 Pro Preview. It ends up being over 100K tokens per query but works really well for me.

[0]: https://llmstxt.org/

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