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How University Students Use Claude

anthropic.com

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Re: How University Students Use Claude

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes it does. Plenty of children accept "you won't always have (tool)" as a reason for learning.

“You won’t always have a calculator” became moderately false to laughably false as I went from middle to high school. Every task I will ever do for money will be done on a computer. I’m still garbage at arithmetic, especially mental math, and it really hasn’t inhibited my career in any way.

It's pretty annoying in customer service when someone handing you back change has difficulty doing the math. There's been many times doing simple arithmetic in my head has been helpful, including times when my hands were occupied.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's more or less accepted today. Bullshit! You cannot do second order reasoning with a set of facts or concepts that you have to look up first. Google Search made intuition and deep understanding and encyclopedic knowledge MORE important, not less. People will think you are a wizard if you read documentation and bother to remember it, because they're still busy asking Google or ChatGPT while you're happily codin…

I am 100% certain people said the same thing about arithmetic and calculators and now mental arithmetic skill is nothing more than a curiosity.

That's simply not true. I use mental arithmetic skill every day. It's irritating or funny when you come across someone who struggles with it, depending on the situation.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#213

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

I think this is a structural issue. Universities right now are trying to justify their existence - universities of the past used to be sites of innovation.

Using ChatGPT doesn't dumb down your students. Not knowing how it works and where to use it does. Don't do silly textbook challenges for exams anymore - reestablish a culture of scientific innovation!

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#214
post #35

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

When modern search became more available, a lot of people said there's no point of rote memorization as you can just do a Google search. That's more or less accepted today. Whenever we have a new technology there's a response "why do I need to learn X if I can always do Y", and more or less, it has proven true, although not immediately. For instance, I'm not too concerned about my child's ability to write very legibl…

> For instance, I'm not too concerned about my child's ability to write very legibly (most writing is done on computers), spell very well (spell check keeps us professional), reading a map to get around (GPS), etc

I don't know. I really feel like the auto-correct features are out to get me. So many times I want to say "in" yet it gets corrected to "on", or vice-versa. I also feel like it does the same to me with they're/their/there. Over the past several iOS/macOS updates, I feel like I've either gotten dumber and no longer do english gooder, or I'm getting tagged by predictive text nonsense.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#215

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

I think this is a structural issue. Universities right now are trying to justify their existence - universities of the past used to be sites of innovation. Using ChatGPT doesn't dumb down your students. Not knowing how it works and where to use it does. Don't do silly textbook challenges for exams anymore - reestablish a culture of scientific innovation!

Incorrect. Fundamentals must be taught in order to provide the context for the more challenging open-ended activities. Memorization is the base of knowledge, a starting point. Cheating (whether through an LLM or hiring someone or whatever) skips the journey. You can't just take them through the exciting routes, sometimes they have to go through the boring tedious repetitive stuff because that's how human brains learn. Learning is, literally, a stressful process on the brain. Students try to avoid it, but that's not good for them. At least in the introductory core classes.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#216
post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flipped classroom means you watch the recorded lecture outside of class time and you do your homework during class time.

Thank you, it's amazing how people don't even try to understand what words mean before dismissing it. Flipped makes way more sense anyway since lectures aren't terribly interactive. Being able to pause/replay/skip around in lectures is underrated.

Except that students don't watch the videos. We have so much log data on this - most of them don't bother to actually watch the videos. They intend to, they think they will, but they don't.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#217

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

I think this is a structural issue. Universities right now are trying to justify their existence - universities of the past used to be sites of innovation. Using ChatGPT doesn't dumb down your students. Not knowing how it works and where to use it does. Don't do silly textbook challenges for exams anymore - reestablish a culture of scientific innovation!

You claim using AI tools doesn't dumb you down, but it very well could and is. Take the calculator for example, I'm overly dependent on it. I'm slower to perform arithmetic than I would have been without it. But knowing how to use one allows me to do more complex math more quickly. So I'm "dumber" in one way and "smarter" in others. AI could be the same... except our education system doesn't seem ready for it. We still learn arithmetic, even if we later rely in tools to do it. Right now teachers don't know how to teach so that AI doesn't trivialize things.

You need to know how to do things so you know when the AI is lying to you.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#218
I'm a professor at an R1 university teaching mostly graduate-level courses with substantive Python programming components.

On the one hand, I've caught some students red handed (ChatGPT generated their exact solution and they were utterly unable to explain the advanced Python that was in their solution) and had to award them 0s for assignments, which was heartbreaking. On the other, I was pleasantly surprised to find that most of my students are not using AI to generate wholesale their submissions for programming assignments--or at least, if they're doing so, they're putting in enough work to make it hard for me to tell, which is still something I'd count as work which gets them to think about code.

There is the more difficult matter, however, of using AI to work through small-scale problems, debug, or explain. On the view that it's kind of analogous to using StackOverflow, this semester I tried a generative AI policy where I give a high-level directive: you may use LLMs to debug or critique your code, but not to write new code. My motivation was that students are going to be using this tech anyway, so I might as well ask them to do it in a way that's as constructive for their learning process as possible. (And I explained exactly this motivation when introducing the policy, hoping that they would be invested enough in their own learning process to hear me.) While I still do end up getting code turned in that is "student-grade" enough that I'm fairly sure an LLM couldn't have generated it directly, I do wonder what the reality of how they really use these models is. And even if they followed the policy perfectly, it's unclear to me whether the learning experience was degraded by always having an easy and correct answer to any problem just a browser tab away.

Looking to the future, I admit I'm still a bit of an AI doomer when it comes to what it's going to do to the median person's cognitive faculties. The most able LLM users engage with them in a way that enhances rather than diminishes their unaided mind. But from what I've seen, the more average user tends to want to outsource thinking to the LLM in order to expend as little mental energy as possible. Will AI be so good in 10 years that most people won't need to really understand code with their unaided mind anymore? Maybe, I don't know. But in the short term I know it's very important, and I don't see how students can develop that skill if they're using LLMs as a constant crutch. I've often wondered if this is like what happened when writing was introduced, and capacity for memorization diminished as it became no longer necessary to memorize epic poetry and so on.

I typically have term projects as the centerpiece of the student's grade in my courses, but next year I think I'm going to start administering in-person midterms, as I fear that students might never internalize fundamentals otherwise.

Re: How University Students Use Claude

#219
post #35

> A common question is: “how much are students using AI to cheat?” That’s hard to answer, especially as we don’t know the specific educational context where each of Claude’s responses is being used. I built a popular product that helps teachers with this problem. Yes, it's "hard to answer", but let's be honest... it's a very very widespread problem. I've talked to hundreds of teachers about this and it's a ubiquitous…

When modern search became more available, a lot of people said there's no point of rote memorization as you can just do a Google search. That's more or less accepted today. Whenever we have a new technology there's a response "why do I need to learn X if I can always do Y", and more or less, it has proven true, although not immediately. For instance, I'm not too concerned about my child's ability to write very legibl…

> So how do I answer my child when he asks "Why should I learn to do X if I can just ask an LLM and it will do it better than me"

1. You won’t always have an LLM. It’s the same reason I still have at least my wife’s phone number memorized.

2. So you can learn to do it better. See point 1.

I wasn’t allowed to use calculators in first and second grade when memorizing multiplication tables, even though a calculator could have finished the exercise faster than me. But I use that knowledge to this day, every day, and often I don’t have a calculator (my phone) handy.

It’s what I tell my kids.

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