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Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

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Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#211

Post by jahewson »

thor-rodrigues wrote: post #97

I really like the idea of shifting the business model for office software. Instead of the current model—where companies develop a tool, lock users into their ecosystem, and profit by bundling software with hosting and storage—we could move to a model where different providers compete to offer the best deployment solutions. This would foster competition based on factors like pricing, encryption, customer support, serv…

Large organisations had access to subscription software long before modern SaaS, and chose to use it. In the 1990s Microsoft offered an Enterprise Agreement that operated in this manner. Support is also something that large organisations value and are happy to subscribe to.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#212

Post by vvpan »

yujzgzc wrote: post #134

I stopped reading at "AGPL". I appreciate the intent but this stuff is impossible to use in practice. Even governments need partners who would likely be hesitant to run it because of that.

How does AGPL work in the context of a non-compiled language like Python? Honest question.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#213

Post by HeatrayEnjoyer »

jdvh wrote: post #78
Xelbair wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>government projects like these are not likely to really push the state-of-the-art forward. why it would need to be state of the art? it needs to be stable and 'good enough'. This isn't rocket science, nor quantum mechanics - this is literally a glorified CRUD app that focuses on documentation.

Because when innovative software isn't made inside the EU then Europeans will simply use the best products made elsewhere.

As of 2025 any US-based services are persona non grata for national security reasons. Which other nation's services could the EU switch to that isn't from US?

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#214

Post by staplers »

ctrlp wrote: post #203

I just cannot understand the appeal of these browser based note taking apps. Notion, Obsidian, Outline? Is it the collaboration feature? Why not just use Google Docs or equivalent? For notes, I don't see the appeal of having a browser interface. I just put my notes in a text file. No protocol, just search for text strings or text tags. If I need hierarchical organization, I use directories. What am I missing out on?

  I don't see the appeal of having a browser interface.
You can thank work-locked machines removing any app-level flexibility. I'm not signing into any google work account on my personal phone.

Browser level access allows for multi-device multi-context (personal/work) access.

Also google docs/drive is deeply unusable when trying to organize mental spaces.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#216

Post by _zoltan_ »

IshKebab wrote: post #178
drowntoge wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tchap looks neat as a Slack alternative, but it seems like it's still only for government workers.

We use Mattermost at work, and apart from the mobile app being a bit shit, and search being kind of useless, it's easily as good as Slack. In some ways it's better, e.g. you can use proper Markdown in messages instead of Slack's Mrkdwn abomination that doesn't even allow links. I wish they would improve search though; it's kind of a critical feature in a company.

search is the #1 feature I use in our corporate slack (huge, huge instance).

without search it's useless.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#217

Post by t00 »

InsideOutSanta wrote: post #15
sebstefan wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their thirst to regulate everything and everyone like they did with GDPR and the gatekeeper legislation? The EU has been a massive force of good for consumer rights As a programmer maybe we weren't meant to just be able to have a "thirst" to store "everything and everyone's" data forever. Just implement the GDPR deletion and the data export batch.

This. Most EU regulations are common sense and/or don't apply to small companies. Have a privacy policy, don't collect unnecessary user data, encrypt data properly, don't use cookies to track people outside what is needed for your website to function, and allow your users to access and delete their data. You should have already done that before GDPR, and if you did not, you're the reason we need the law.

Agreed about your points, not so much about paper drink straws.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#218

Post by crazygringo »

dewey wrote: post #181
crazygringo wrote: post #179

I'm intrigued by the decision to call it "Docs". In any other circumstance it would be a clear trademark infringement on Google Docs. It's literally the same product with the same name, it has an extremely similar logo and almost exactly the same typeface in its logo. But since this is a government project between France and Germany, maybe governments are allowed to ignore trademarks? Or Google wants to stay on their…

I guess that's the "problem" with generic product names. There's also Apple Calendar, Google Calendar, Microsoft Calendar etc. - Docs is not different than that.

"Docs" isn't that generic. It's not even a word in the dictionary. It's the plural of an abbreviation. Nobody called a word processor "Docs" before Google did.

If you say "open Calendar", I don't know if you mean Apple or Google or Microsoft. If you say "open Docs", I know it's Google and only Google.

This is no different than if the project called itself "Word", which would be equally confusing with Microsoft.

Neither Docs nor Word are genericized. They're both totally valid trademarks. Which is why naming this project "Docs" would be immediately shut down if any private organization tried it. And I've never heard of governments infringing private trademarks before, so I'm curious what's going on here.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#219

Post by jisnsm »

Imustaskforhelp wrote: post #172
jisnsm wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Europe is hopeless. It’s an old continent full of old people who have a deeply vested interest in maintaining the status quo. What Europe needs is a revolution of the young, but demographically that is impossible to happen. The old are willing to sell the young cheap if it means their pensions get increased by 0.1%. That is the source of all the problems in the continent, everything stems from that. From out…

"I think Europe is hopeless. It’s an old continent full of old people who have a deeply vested interest in maintaining the status quo" By this , do you mean the Average age of a person or birth rate or what exactly , because I think europe doesn't have those issues. Are you mentioning the fact that Europe has power vested in the old. Doesn't everybody ? Maybe you are mentioning this in the fact that europe doesn't ha…

Look at population pyramids. Europe is old.

Most people are looking up to retirement and their pensions. The system is unsustainable and predatory on young people. They pay an overwhelming amount of taxes to sustain this system. It also needs massive immigration which causes severe security and cultural problems, but they don’t care as long as that guarantees they will get their pension.

Same about housing. It’s old people who own houses. They vote so new housing doesn’t get built as to keep the high value of their houses. They don’t care that young people can’t afford rent.

Many other examples you can think of probably. It’s a society that caters to the old. The young get screwed. And there’s nothing they can do because they are outnumbered and that will only get worse.

This is the status quo. A society that functions like this is dead.

Re: Docs – Open source alternative to Notion or Outline

#220

Post by sitkack »

nchagnet wrote: post #6

This is a really great project from both the French and German governments. I think state-funded open source solutions to digital platforms is a fantastic opportunity to get away from the big tech walled gardens. Of course, there is always the risk that this becomes unmaintained in the future, but the community at least can take over. But until then, it's a nice platform and a nice contribution to the community.

That is what grants are for! The government(s) get the exact software they want by a whole field full of folks that know how to make those changes.
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