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Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

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Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#211

Post by echoangle »

willy_k wrote: post #123
echoangle wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When I say the FAA light patterns were off, what I mean is that it had two red lights on the outside, and two green lights on the inside. AFAIK, the only type of aircraft that might have that configuration is a trans-wing drone. What? How do you get from a specific kind of lighting to „trans-wing drone“? What prevents me from lighting a regular-wing RC plane with the same lighting configuration?

> What prevents me from lighting a regular-wing RC plane with the same lighting configuration? If I’m not mistaken, the FAA does (unless RC planes aren’t covered?). Are you really positing that I saw an intentionally misconfigured RC plane flying in the middle of nowhere at 2 AM? You’re right that I’m making a leap with the trans-wing part. I said that because it’s my understanding that some of the sightings have inc…

> If I’m not mistaken, the FAA does (unless RC planes aren’t covered?). Are you really positing that I saw an intentionally misconfigured RC plane flying in the middle of nowhere at 2 AM?

So the FAA prevents me from using the scheme you described, but the drones you think you observed are exempt?

I still don’t see how you can draw any conclusion from the lighting, unless the lighting you saw is only permitted for a specific class of object.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#212

Post by echoangle »

willy_k wrote: post #126
echoangle wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s almost certain that they are military drones, and if I had to guess they’re searching for something that would cause real mass hysteria if told to the public. Why is that almost certain?

Well almost is doing a lot of heavy lifting, the case is all circumstantial. But I say that both because of a Reddit post that makes a strong case that at least some portion of sightings are a specific model of navy drone, and more so because their being military is the only situation where the government response makes sense to me. If they were an enemy’s, one would expect them to be shot down. If they were an ally’…

Can you link the post?

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#213

Post by carabiner »

stevenhuang wrote: post #198
carabiner wrote: post #57

The subreddit /r/njdrones is sooo off the rails right now. It started out as "I think this is a drone, maybe military?" to classifying different drones as energy "orbs" and "mimics" that only look like airplanes when photographed.

Consider that you are uninformed about the UAP phenomenon.

[flagged]

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#214

Post by oneshtein »

bagels wrote: post #194
f3z0 wrote: post #156

Are you saying the drones and planes have always been there and we are just noticing it now?

It's probably regular airplanes, stars, and Venus, and now, I assume civilian drones. Once people started claiming drones, other people who never bothered to look in to the sky started seeing lights they didn't understand (planes, stars, planets) because they never bothered to study the night sky in even a basic way, and they are suggestible. Then people probably started flying their own drones to do investigation +…

+ StarLinks or other low orbit satellites and space stations. In 2014, when Russian invasion started in Ukraine, we had so many reports from folks about drones in the sky about ISS or Venus. I saw this myself when I was at Chongar, near to Russian occupied Crimea: my comrades pointed to bright Venus in the night sky and said that it can be a Russian drone. I dismissed the claim by pointing out that army doesn't turn lights on when on mission.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#215

Post by Eisenstein »

WalterBright wrote: post #203
Eisenstein wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But again, that is access to knowledge. How good would your college education have been if there was no library or textbooks? If you took the athletes today without their support team and sent them back in time two years before an Olympics event to compete on their own, I don't think it would be as big of a blowout as you suggest.

Interesting that you mention textbooks. Most of my STEM classes in college did not have a textbook, or recommended a book that was kinda irrelevant to the direction the classes took. BTW, the discovery of the Scientific Method was a great leap forward in how to discover more knowledge.

> Most of my STEM classes in college did not have a textbook, or recommended a book that was kinda irrelevant to the direction the classes took.

So you went through classes with no written material? You listened to lecture, took notes, and then did assignments and passed tests with no documents to study?

> BTW, the discovery of the Scientific Method was a great leap forward in how to discover more knowledge.

The scientific method is a set of protocols that are followed in order to formalize evidence and prediction. Putting it into a set of words is important, but not required. Humans managed to sail across oceans and build wonders just fine without it.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#216

Post by Eisenstein »

WalterBright wrote: post #206
Eisenstein wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More likely it was because the systems didn't exist that incentivized figuring out solutions to the problems which technology solves. Agriculture, animal husbandry, arts, warfare, engineering were all very sophisticated, limited by the materials science available (firearms, for instance, need very strong metals not to explode). The scientists that existed before the industrial age in the West were upper class, bored…

> More likely it was because the systems didn't exist that incentivized figuring out solutions to the problems which technology solves. That is partially true. There is no incentive, for example, for slaves to make any improvements. I cannot think of any technology developed by slaves. That meant the few people in power were not enough to think of much new stuff. You could say free markets were the greatest invention…

> That is partially true. There is no incentive, for example, for slaves to make any improvements. I cannot think of any technology developed by slaves. That meant the few people in power were not enough to think of much new stuff.

You can't think of any technology developed by slaves because they wouldn't get credit for it. I am sure all sorts of useful things have been invented by slaves, but if you yourself are property I don't know how you expect credit for your intellectual property.

> You could say free markets were the greatest invention, because it incentivized everyone to be a creator.

The free markets are about efficient allocation and exploitation of resources. People are incentivized to create things that help with that. The byproduct of such efficiency is free time and access to those resources.

> The latter occurred over thousands of years. Very very slow!

Well, it isn't exactly easy to invent a lightbulb when you don't have access to vacuum pumps, transparent glass, filaments, and electric generators. I'm sure if you had a hunk of ore and a hearth you would be making machined parts within a fortnight but our ancestors had to wait for crucial inventions and materials science advances before they move from sails to steam.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#217

Post by kelseyfrog »

WalterBright wrote: post #203
Eisenstein wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But again, that is access to knowledge. How good would your college education have been if there was no library or textbooks? If you took the athletes today without their support team and sent them back in time two years before an Olympics event to compete on their own, I don't think it would be as big of a blowout as you suggest.

Interesting that you mention textbooks. Most of my STEM classes in college did not have a textbook, or recommended a book that was kinda irrelevant to the direction the classes took. BTW, the discovery of the Scientific Method was a great leap forward in how to discover more knowledge.

Kind of makes you wonder if there are other epistemological generators even more powerful than science waiting to be discovered.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#218

Post by mithametacs »

Vegenoid wrote: post #100
kryogen1c wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that people, on the whole, vastly underestimate the degree to which humans are animals.

I don’t understand how people underestimate it so badly when we have so much history we are taught that demonstrates it. History makes it abundantly clear that it is a regular occurrence for large groups of people to collectively believe things for which there is little evidence, and furthermore, to take extreme actions based on such beliefs. This applies to you too, reader. Many would read the above and fully agree…

I've undergone psychiatric care for things not related to psychosis. As for psychosis, I am mentally healthy.

As a child I was obsessed with math. I had a pseudo-religious obsession with Platonism, connected with my childhood fear of mortality. A bizarre belief system.

While trying to make new friends in a new city, I was shunned from a new group for unknown reasons. I was going through a breakup from an abuser. I was depressed and grasping for explanations, thinking I was being conspired against. A persecution complex.

Lack of information and strong emotion are enough.

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#219

Post by robocat »

ceejayoz wrote: post #120
j_timberlake wrote: post #78

This was literally my first thought for the anomalous drones like 2 weeks ago, and it was immediately obvious that the entire NJ police department should not be incompetent enough to fall for something so obvious. The mayors and governor should not be dumb enough to stake their reputations on this when the null hypothesis of "mass hysteria" is easier and safer. Even back then, we knew the sightings do not appear on f…

> Also NJ police report the anomalous drones give off no heat signature like normal drones... These are the same people who have panic attacks when they think they've been exposed to fentanyl (which usually involves them describing symptoms not consistent with opiate exposure, and mysteriously the officers never seem to test positive for it in the hospital). https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8810663/ In realit…

> pure, liquid, lab-grade fentanyl ... just washes their hands.

Your description is a little hyperbolic! That pubmed paper referenced "10 microgram fentanyl citrate base per ml" approx 0.00001% fentanyl "over a large skin surface area".

Pharmaceutical form for injection is fentanyl 50µg/mL (as citrate). https://www.medsafe.govt.nz/profs/Datasheet/f/Fentanylinj.pd...

Re: Windshield pitting incidents in Washington reach fever pitch on April 15, 1954 (2003)

#220

Post by j_timberlake »

jklinger410 wrote: post #127
j_timberlake wrote: post #78

This was literally my first thought for the anomalous drones like 2 weeks ago, and it was immediately obvious that the entire NJ police department should not be incompetent enough to fall for something so obvious. The mayors and governor should not be dumb enough to stake their reputations on this when the null hypothesis of "mass hysteria" is easier and safer. Even back then, we knew the sightings do not appear on f…

Lots of smart guys in this comment thread who already know what this stuff is. No need to panic folks, the armchair critics say everything is ok.

The funny thing is, in this thread they're all certain the drones are just mass hysteria. In the thread a week ago, there were tons of people certain these drones were just secret USA drones, nothing to worry about. "Almost no chance these are not US military.", "I guarantee it's some local police agency that got them donated by the military.", etc.

Completely incompatible hand-wave theories living side by side, rarely bothering to debate each other or provide anything beyond opinions.

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