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Our First Generalist Policy

physicalintelligence.company

211–220 of 249 posts

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#211
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was down voted before for asking a similar question, I have no idea what the plan is but I struggle to understand what the future looks like when we literally have nothing to do. Why would I even bother with a hobby when a robot can do everything 10x better? Maybe just "enjoy nature" would be the best bet if we survive the robot wars.

interestingly chess has made a huge comeback recently even though this was a widely-held attitude for a while after Deep Blue.

Engines have reached the point where the best human in the world would be lucky to score one draw and 99 losses in a hundred-game match, but the game isn’t solved (and very likely never will be). I think that if it had been solved, it would have gone the way of checkers. People don’t mind it so much if computers are better than humans at a game so long as the game itself isn’t “trivialized” by being solved.

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#212
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bifurcation of society with fewer and fewer people moving upward in social status. The poor have nothing. The bar of assets required to not become poor continues to raise. For example, let’s say you have 5M NW, and 75% of it is in an uninsurable residential real estate. Your house is at high risk of being destroyed, and if it does you barely have the assets required to rebuild. If this happens twice you are have noth…

That seems unrealistic. Can you give us an example of a specific residential property that is both uninsurable, and recently sold for ~$4M? Being uninsurable tends to crush value.

Sure, so your primary residence becoming uninsurable is another way to go from have to have not

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#213
post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bifurcation of society with fewer and fewer people moving upward in social status. The poor have nothing. The bar of assets required to not become poor continues to raise. For example, let’s say you have 5M NW, and 75% of it is in an uninsurable residential real estate. Your house is at high risk of being destroyed, and if it does you barely have the assets required to rebuild. If this happens twice you are have noth…

Let’s say I have 10M in stocks. What is the optimal strategy to not end up as “have nothing poor” in an automated economy?

Try to advance to 100M. 10M might not be enough in 50 years.

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#214
post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand the distinction you are making: two couples (4 people) meeting at a restaurant is, to me, equally social as one couple going to another couple's house to eat dinner.

Four people in a public space interacting with the rest of the community is fundamentally different to four people in an isolated silo.

Having to listen to some drunk two tables over matter away is not desirable community interaction.

It’s nice to be able to carry on a conversation somewhere there isn’t a constant din.

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#215
post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Four people in a public space interacting with the rest of the community is fundamentally different to four people in an isolated silo.

Having to listen to some drunk two tables over matter away is not desirable community interaction. It’s nice to be able to carry on a conversation somewhere there isn’t a constant din.

[flagged]

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a huge underclass with nothing, nothing to do, and no access to that automation Why do you think the poor won't have AGI in their pockets and robots as well? If we look at how LLMs are evolving, they become easier to run on edge, and there are so many of them being pushed out every day. Costs for robotic hardware are also going down fast. Intelligence is free to have, unlike UBI. And robots can build robots, or mak…

If you don't have a job that allows you to pay the rent and food, then access to AGI tools -- even free -- won't help you very much.

I don't know why you'd say that. Makes applying for EBT and food stamps easier. And finding the local soup kitchens, the best places to buy a tent, what the laws against vagrancy and camping "overnight" in your car. Which brands of cat food are least unhealthy for human consumption. (you'll have to jailbreak the model to have it answer that last one.)

Those are probably going to be quite a lot of help!

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that feels like a rather extreme jump to conclusions, and was certainly not something I thought the GP comment was even suggesting. I don't see any reason why people couldn't adjust from meeting friends at restaurants to hosting friends at home instead. (Unless, of course, your living space is limited) If you aren't cooking and cleaning up after, what's the difference between that and meeting someone at a resta…

> If you aren't cooking and cleaning up after, what's the difference between that and meeting someone at a restaurant? I wonder if you realise how dystopian your life already is to consider this question reasonable. There is a difference between a co-located set of siloed people and a community. The inability to recognise this means your community is already broken.

I suppose our restaurant-going experiences must significantly differ. If I'm going to a restaurant with friends for social interaction, it typically doesn't involve the other people in the restaurant who just happen to be there at the same time as me.

If I wanted that, I would go to a bar instead, which is a separate conversation from the one we were having.

However, I don't think I would be so bold as to call either of our lifestyles 'broken'. That feels like a needless attack.

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#218
post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having to listen to some drunk two tables over matter away is not desirable community interaction. It’s nice to be able to carry on a conversation somewhere there isn’t a constant din.

[flagged]

Please stop telling me how I'm supposed to feel. It's dismissive and incredibly rude.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#219
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fairly confident that that was sarcasm.

It was not. Maybe measured in relative terms the middle class is shrinking due to income inequality, but in absolute terms I am fairly confident it is at worst stagnating in America and western Europe. In many parts of the rest of the world there has been an amazing growth of a middle class that didn't exist before in the last decades. Eastern europe and asia of course.

I'm not certain what you base your confidence on given trackable economic and social mobility markers don't support it. Its fascinating that apologists default to some combination of postmodern argle-bargle over defining the term "middle class" and pointing to modest economic successes in what until recently were unambiguously 3rd world countries when a discussion of the middle class in America comes up. I honestly do not understand the perceived relevance of economic outcomes in ex-soviet countries in this context, unless the goal is to provide some kind of cover for neoliberal economic theory, which also seems nonsensical unless one is some form of pundit or politician.

50 years ago a single income family being able to afford to own their home, at least one car in the driveway, school their children, and comfortably save for retirement was the generally accepted definition of "middle class". I honestly can't be bothered to even look up what passes for a more modern definition given regardless of where those goalposts get planted someone's going to argue anything north of abject poverty is "middle class". After having sat a few hundred iterations of that debate I think I can feel my soul trying to leave my body at the mere thought of doing another lap.

One of the things that freaks me out the most about this kind of cognitive-dissonance-fueled shit flinging contest is I am deeply mystified by the notion that there's even anything controversial here. Rural America is not ok. The average cost of a house and a medical degree in the US are approaching parity. The current rise in populism also didn't spontaneously arise, it's a reaction to economic pressure (among other things). How much worse does it have to get before the conversation pivots from "is there a problem" to "k, maybe we should work on some of this"?

Re: Our First Generalist Policy

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is our goal to reduce the gap between the rich and the poor, or to improve the lives of the poor? Because the gap itself is actually irrelevant to poor people's lives. Rich people's improvement outpacing poor people's is not necessarily an issue. Second, a financial gap does not necessarily translate to a material gap. Someone with 1,000,000x someone else's net worth still buys the same iPhone and drinks the same coc…

> Is our goal to reduce the gap between the rich and the poor, or to improve the lives of the poor? Because the gap itself is actually irrelevant to poor people's lives. The resources to improve the lives of the poor (and not just the very poor but the struggling middle classes), have to come from somewhere. They are not infinite. So unless you're creating a bunch of wealth from nothing, then it naturally requires a…

But financial wealth is not equal to material wealth. Financial wealth literally is created from nothing, and its mapping to material wealth is arbitrary. The last 4 years are a great example of massive paper gains while everyone was losing.

There are real diminishing returns to money. Some issues are surely caused by lack of funding, but that's not most real issues. Most real issues will remain even despite maximal funding. So before you start advocating for taking people's wealth you have to make a convincing argument that it can solve something.

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