OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors • Hacker News Board

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#211

Post by chii » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 6:55 AM UTC

im3w1l wrote: post #188

wnc3141 wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is inevitable. Organizational design turns out to be critical in aligning interests and incentives from the outset across all organizations throughout history - from the Roman Empire to Open AI

It's amazingly ironic that a charity focused on aligning AI couldn't even align its own CEO.

because they aren't really a charity, and they aren't really interested in aligning AI. In the end, it's all an attempt to profit - with the initial marketing about charity/alignment that those with wishful thinking all bought into.

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#212

Post by adastra22 » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 6:57 AM UTC

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #203

apantel wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Greed” is one of those words where the definition doesn’t really tell you where the line is: “intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth, power, or food.” (Oxford via Google) Who doesn’t feel “intense and selfish desire” for money? Who doesn’t feel that going into a performance review? It’s human nature to feel this feeling, if that’s what we want to call “greed”.

Just speaking for myself but if I were getting a 500k salary, my remaining concerns would shift in the direction of worrying about the longevity of human civilization, and less about the value of my equity comp. That's because I'd have enough to put a roof over my kids heads and food on their plate, so the world they grow up in would be my next priority. That would probably have me siding with the board against Altma…

No, you'd buy a bigger house, put your kids in private school, start taking bigger vacations, and find that $500k doesn't go as far as you thought it would.

I mean, objectively that's what happens to 95% of people in that situation. Hedonic adaptation is a bitch.

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#213

Post by chii » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 6:57 AM UTC

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #203

apantel wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Greed” is one of those words where the definition doesn’t really tell you where the line is: “intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth, power, or food.” (Oxford via Google) Who doesn’t feel “intense and selfish desire” for money? Who doesn’t feel that going into a performance review? It’s human nature to feel this feeling, if that’s what we want to call “greed”.

Just speaking for myself but if I were getting a 500k salary, my remaining concerns would shift in the direction of worrying about the longevity of human civilization, and less about the value of my equity comp. That's because I'd have enough to put a roof over my kids heads and food on their plate, so the world they grow up in would be my next priority. That would probably have me siding with the board against Altma…

> if I were getting a 500k salary

but you're not, presumably. And when you _do_ have that sort of salary, your circle of friends and priorities will also change along with it. At least, for the average person who also makes your claim.

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#214

Post by chii » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 6:59 AM UTC

geodel wrote: post #115

pdonis wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My takeaway is that neither side comes out of this looking very good.

Well, what is supposed to be good in this situation and to whom?

> what is supposed to be good

why do you presume that there must be a good party here?

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#215

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:05 AM UTC

mitthrowaway2 wrote: post #203

apantel wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Greed” is one of those words where the definition doesn’t really tell you where the line is: “intense and selfish desire for something, especially wealth, power, or food.” (Oxford via Google) Who doesn’t feel “intense and selfish desire” for money? Who doesn’t feel that going into a performance review? It’s human nature to feel this feeling, if that’s what we want to call “greed”.

Just speaking for myself but if I were getting a 500k salary, my remaining concerns would shift in the direction of worrying about the longevity of human civilization, and less about the value of my equity comp. That's because I'd have enough to put a roof over my kids heads and food on their plate, so the world they grow up in would be my next priority. That would probably have me siding with the board against Altma…

[deleted]

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#216

Post by adastra22 » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:09 AM UTC

cooper_ganglia wrote: post #95

code51 wrote: post #7

If AGI achieved, Microsoft doesn't have the claim on it commercially. Microsoft with 49% stake in the for-profit entity and non-observer seat, what actually protects Microsoft here? First hand information that AGI is reached? Are we not seeing a card in Microsoft's hand here?

Do we have a formal legal definition for AGI?

AGI means artificial general intelligence.

Artificial: man-made

General: able to transfer knowledge between domains and work on problem domains it was not trained on

Intelligence: efficiently solves problems

We've had A.G.I. since 2017.

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#217

Post by murakamiiq84 » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:15 AM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #176

pdonis wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering all the talk about AI risks, talk which has been put out by Altman and the others involved in this as much as anyone, I would say "good" would mean people who can be trusted to be responsible stewards of such a potentially risky technology. At the very least, that would mean people who (a) can act like mature adults, and (b) have a healthy amount of humility. I don't see either of those characteristics in…

There exist literally zero organizations on the planet that I would fully trust to build anything approaching AGI on behalf of humanity

Same, but some animals are more equal than others. I'd personally trust one of those Japanese companies that lasted hundreds of years more on questions like stability and carefulness, compared to a flash-in-the-pan SV startup that's been around since 2016.

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#218

Post by atleastoptimal » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:16 AM UTC

halfmatthalfcat wrote: post #168

atleastoptimal wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your appraisal seems to stem from a lot of people's disillusionment with the whole OpenAI thing: namely that GenAI is a hype train and will fade away as a gimmicky toy with limited real world-use cases. It's interesting seeing that perspective, because while I think it's based on a comparison of GenAI with prior "change everything" hype trains (VR, crypto), it's clearly not the same, and you and most people really do…

> most people really don't understand just how much everything is about to change So instead of hedging and saying "it's going to change some things", you play into the "it's going to change everything?". Its stereotypical grandstanding when nobody really knows what is going to happen. The AI bros and AI deniers are both exhausting crowds.

because it will change everything

everything good in your life is because of applied intelligence

now imagine 1000x the intelligence at 1000x the intensity

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#219

Post by atleastoptimal » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:16 AM UTC

dralley wrote: post #200

atleastoptimal wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your appraisal seems to stem from a lot of people's disillusionment with the whole OpenAI thing: namely that GenAI is a hype train and will fade away as a gimmicky toy with limited real world-use cases. It's interesting seeing that perspective, because while I think it's based on a comparison of GenAI with prior "change everything" hype trains (VR, crypto), it's clearly not the same, and you and most people really do…

>The real-world utility is already enormous in the form it is now. You really think there's no real-world utility to GPT-4, Claude, and all the models that are coming out? I'm not who you're responding to, but I think it's at least true that there is enough competition, including open source competition, to make some of the current valuations a bit fanciful.

open source models cannot compete

Re: OpenAI board reappoints Altman and adds three other directors

#220

Post by UberFly » Sat, Mar 09, 2024, 7:18 AM UTC

minimaxir wrote: post #14

The conclusion just raises further questions on why the coup happened, other than a "consequence of a breakdown in the relationship and loss of trust between the prior Board and Mr. Altman".

It all feels very Godfather Part 1-ish.