Live data from Hacker News

TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

pr.tsmc.com

211–220 of 526 posts

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#211
post #178

For those unfamiliar with the region (Saxony, Dresden): A registered association ( e.V. in German) bluntly named "Silicon Saxony e.V." (est. in 2000) with over 450 members headquartered in Dresden pretty much sums up the infrastructure and ambition.[0][1] As pointed out the process TSMC’s 28/22 nanometer planar CMOS and 16/12 nanometer FinFET process technology (fabrication will begin in 2027) is not "cutting edge" b…

I guess we are the redundancy to taiwan soon...

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#212

Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. Realpolitk wise they absolutely cannot risk regulatory capture to a few select firms on the west coast of the USA. Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after…

> Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after Italy rightfully brought up issues with data privacy. This wouldn't be a big deal. GPT is not some one-of-a-kind leaps-and-bounds ahead of everyone else ground-breaking technology.

Still in denial?

I have a hard time understanding the people who visit this website and havent used the technology.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#213
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. All the big economic success was due to state coordination and intervention, not (neo-)liberalism. Liberalism might work for a smaller country that becomes a trading hub (like Singapore), and uses low taxes as a sort of parasitic strategy; that's why it cannot be replicated by large countries. I am glad that Germany is coming to their senses and finally rejecting neoliberalism. Now if only Eurozone leadershi…

Singapore’s economy is also significantly planned, despite the opposite being the common knowledge. Same with South Korea.

Yeah, that only strengthens my argument that neoliberalism has failed.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#214
post #3

Wonder if the Taiwanese govt at some point will step in and block these onshoring measures as a matter of national security. If countries are less reliant on manufacturing within Taiwan, its one less reason to stand up to Beijing's one China principle.

You don’t see how that would immediately produce blowback? Is Congress going to say “oh shucks” and authorise another weapons deal? Or might they redirect those dollars domestically while reducing patrols of the Taiwan Straits?

It's extremely unlikely for the US to do that as if China takes Taiwan it will be a huge blow to the US and to the value of being a US ally.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#215
post #123
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or just use fax. That's how it works in Germany

But you can only fax during opening hours which are Tuesday 10:00 to 11:15

And during that time, you get an error report telling you the remote fax is out of paper (true story).

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#216
post #179

Along with (hopefully) that french startup (Mistral) founded by the LLaMA guys, the EU is putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. Realpolitk wise they absolutely cannot risk regulatory capture to a few select firms on the west coast of the USA. Altman himself threatened (for a brief period) to cut off GPT to the EU after…

> putting together the pieces they need to keep up with AI and maintain their ability to leverage their control mechanisms upon the FAANGS. from the press release itself: > ESMC marks a significant step towards construction of a 300mm fab to support the future capacity needs of the fast-growing automotive and industrial sectors, with the final investment decision pending confirmation of the level of public funding fo…

> it's a 300mm fab.

300mm wafer diameter, yes. That's state of the art, with some vendors looking at 450mm with little to show for now.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#217
post #56

Just want to share these relevant videos from Asianometry: How Semiconductors Ruined East Germany https://youtu.be/cxrkC-pMH_s Why Europe Lost Semiconductors https://youtu.be/5ZdmS-EAbHo Europe’s Lost Decades in Semiconductors https://youtu.be/PpSdytrNEBg It's great to get chip manufacturing back to Germany after all the struggles, even if it's not cutting edge.

I watched a few of their videos, but I felt like it was an anti-china propaganda outlet.

I'm def not a fan of the CCP, so I loved watching the videos, but I felt like I was getting brainwashed.

Does anyone know how valid/factual their videos are?

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#218
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Literally impossible. You don't re-fit a fab, you build it from scratch. There is very little technological overlap where it matters due to the shift to EUV. You'd essentially have to scrap >75% of the fab to fit in the new equipment.

Not only that, but the fab undergoing the 2 - 5 year refit would also not be in full production capability. So there is the revenue loss in addition to everything else. and suddenly just building new makes even more sense.

Not everything needs cutting edge chips.

Heck, I can use crappy chips for every home appliance and home IOT device.

Sure I want high end stuff for my laptop so I can do AI, but that is just 1 application.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the grand scheme you are correct - there is enough US corporations' tech in ASML machines so that the US government has enough leverage to force ASML to comply with its export restrictions. But your details aren't exactly right, I think. Cymer builds light sources for DUV, not EUV. The EUV light sources are built by Trumpf in Germany, at least as far as I know.

You're incorect. Trumpf doesn't make EUV light sources, just lasers. Cymer builds the EUV light sources, by blasting microparticles of tin with said Trumpf lasers to generate EUV light. > at least as far as I know. You could have also googled this to factcheck before posting if you were unsure ;)

Since ASML builds/integrates the machine, is there any reason why they couldn’t just pull out the EUV laser from the machine, but keep the trumpf lasers, zeiss mirrors and everything else. Then China could just copy the “shooting tin droplets with a laser at 50khz” part.

Re: TSMC, Bosch, Infineon, NXP to jointly build semiconductor fab in Europe

#220
post #178

For those unfamiliar with the region (Saxony, Dresden): A registered association ( e.V. in German) bluntly named "Silicon Saxony e.V." (est. in 2000) with over 450 members headquartered in Dresden pretty much sums up the infrastructure and ambition.[0][1] As pointed out the process TSMC’s 28/22 nanometer planar CMOS and 16/12 nanometer FinFET process technology (fabrication will begin in 2027) is not "cutting edge" b…

I guess we are the redundancy to taiwan soon...

One of the redundancies, and not a very high end one
Post reply on HN