Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

theverge.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

211–220 of 361 posts

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#211

Post by prox »

samwillis wrote: post #120

Google operates an exchange for a digital asset, is a major vendor/trader of said asset on that exchange and operates an algorithmic trading platform to enable people to buy and sell on that exchange. On top of that the algorithmic trades are a "black box" with no audit trail, and no public insight into how it operates. If that sounds familiar, think illegal crypto exchanges... Obviously "ads" are not "securities", b…

This is where I stand, I operate some ad accounts but the amount of control and insight taken away with each update is really noticeable. Really interesting is that I actually get zero input on how much I pay on each day. You give a budget for the day but I don’t have a lot of control over it unless I micromanage the thing. It’s crazy and I hope the EU will go hard on Google.

Edit So more about payments. It used to be I could just give a lump sum and let Google Ads play until there is no more budget.

Not anymore, and -I don’t have a choice-. You can only use a bank account which you give Google Ads control over, and if you forget to set end dates, the thing will keep on rolling. For me it’s another dark pattern build in. For some big clients no big deal probably, I just want to point out there is not a lot of control or choice.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#212

Post by jsnell »

gumballindie wrote: post #77

And microsoft is walking scot free. They can happily control operating systems, office tools, a slice of search, ides, ads within their os, are allowed to buy large game makers and soon ai. As a bare minimum they should be forced greater compatibility with running their software on linux and ideally be banned from doing ads, ai and gamedev.

EU just in the last month launched an antitrust probe into Microsoft's preferential licensing of their software (like Windows, SQL Server) when run on Azure compared to running it on other clouds. Probes aren't guaranteed to turn into enforcement, but Microsoft is certainly not able to act without scrutiny.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#213

Post by piva00 »

aurareturn wrote: post #204
piva00 wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I did. And I subscribe to Kagi right now (since Nov/2022) after Neeva, and will keep trying to find paid search solutions if Kagi ever goes belly up.

Great. So there are plenty of choices, both paid and free. Why did you say there's no competition?

[flagged]

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#214

Post by Mashimo »

pb7 wrote: post #60
holoduke wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love to see Google leaving Europe. I bet within a few weeks proper maybe even better replacements appear in Europe. Maybe even one of mine :) Google is an ad company. None of its services are critical to maintain a stable society. I would even argue that Europe would be better of without the American tech giants.

Europe would return to the dark ages if all American tech companies pulled out overnight. But it is a humorous thought that the only way there can be European alternatives is if there are no American companies to compete against. What is it about Europe that puts it so far behind the US and Asia in innovation? >None of its services are critical to maintain a stable society. Except Android, Maps, Search, Gmail, YouTub…

> What is it about Europe that puts it so far behind the US and Asia in innovation?

How far behind is Europe?

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#215

Post by hef19898 »

delfinom wrote: post #134
gylterud wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about an automatic nationalisation in stead? Where you take companies which have grown too big out of the private ownership’s hands.

Too dangerous unless it's a service that should be a vital government service. You do not want your government to basically have a permanent monopoly on everything. This just gives power to authoritarian to rise.

Democracy allows authrotarians to rise in and of itself. Recent ones include Orban, Erdogan and Trump. Historical ones include, yes I know, Mussolini and Hitler.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#216

Post by resolutebat »

EscapeFromNY wrote: post #173
aurareturn wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Holy cow. People are comparing Google to crypto exchanges now. Blockchains are public, yes. But the entities behind them are completely and utterly cryptic and centralized. Most of them operate out of Cayman Islands/Bahamas, etc. Comparing Google to crypto exchanges is insane.

If you don't want to send your money to the Bahamas, you have the choice as a consumer to use a regulated US-based exchange instead. You don't have to be ultra-savvy to read wikipedia and learn about a company before doing business with them. With Google, you're spending money in a completely opaque marketplace with 0 visibility or transparency, and no choice as a consumer to mitigate that.

A regulated US-based exchange like, say, FTX US or Binance US?

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#217

Post by EscapeFromNY »

aurareturn wrote: post #200
EscapeFromNY wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, being able to read smart contracts and audit transactions on the blockchain is how everyone knew FTX stealing customer funds from years ago. Yes in fact! Anyone who looked into it knew. Maybe Wall Street and VCs were duped, but the crypto industry itself saw the train wreck coming from a mile away and distanced themselves from the start. That's why when the inevitable happened, the mainstream were pumping out…

That's a load of revisionist history. FTX's schemes were only exposed AFTER they couldn't handle withdrawals. Anyone who follows crypto closely knows that every crypto exchange is crooked. Even crypto bros will tell you that. I can say that Binance is shady and likely stealing from their customers and I'll more likely to be correct than not. Saying FTX was shady before they were exposed was not a bold statement.

Not revisionist, you can literally just search reddit for posts from before the collapse to confirm.

https://old.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/cj5ovr/ftx_... (2019)

https://old.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/m6b53a/sbf_... (2021)

You're right about Binance, but the same wouldn't be true about Fidelity, Coinbase, Kraken, etc. People with an axe to grind about crypto like to pretend the industry is homogeneous and always complain about the likes of FTX and Binance (who are in the news a lot for reasons you'd expect), but conveniently never have anything to say about the exchanges with a good track record that people actually use and trust.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#218

Post by prox »

cageface wrote: post #208
samwillis wrote: post #120

Google operates an exchange for a digital asset, is a major vendor/trader of said asset on that exchange and operates an algorithmic trading platform to enable people to buy and sell on that exchange. On top of that the algorithmic trades are a "black box" with no audit trail, and no public insight into how it operates. If that sounds familiar, think illegal crypto exchanges... Obviously "ads" are not "securities", b…

Google deserves a lot of recent criticism but at the same time I think they provide an important counterbalance to Apple and Microsoft. I especially don’t want to see Android go away as the only competitor to iOS.

“Google is bad but don’t take away my counterbalance against Apple/MS?” , bit of an odd conclusion.

Breaking up a monopoly is always good, it will give us consumers more choice. Gives them less power of politicians.

Plus Android is open source so I think you got nothing to worry about.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#219

Post by sofixa »

senttoschool wrote: post #12

Should the US break up LVMH given how dominant they are in luxury goods?

That's a good point, but falls apart under a closer look. I'd argue luxury goods are by definition a completely separate market where the same rules simply don't apply; something as essential (not in the classic economic sense of starving without them, but in the practical sense that pretty much everyone uses it practically on a daily basis) as search, online ads, etc. should be regulated entirely differently. The impact and importance of impact is entirely different.

If there's anything to break up in terms of European companies, that'd be Alstom which are top 2 in rail transportation (but whose competition from China is growing rapidly so their global position is under threat), which btw wasn't allowed to merge with Siemens. Can't really think of another sane example.

Re: EU suggests breaking up Google's ad business in preliminary antitrust ruling

#220

Post by inamorty »

Detrytus wrote: post #169
bee_rider wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, we can’t really complain. The international capitalist system owes Ireland a bit more; its predecessor, colonialism, screwed Ireland over for generations.

But the point is that Ireland does not really benefit from this money - it is only an accounting trick. Google funnels money through Ireland, but does not employ many people in Ireland, and does not pay much taxes there. In the end, the living standard of typical Irishman is closer to countries with $40-45k GDP, such as Italy or France, than to countries with $100k GDP, such as Norway or Switzerland.

This is not true. If anything Ireland is too reliant on a few multi-national corporations. In 2022, corporate tax was the second highest income stream for the state: https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/4992b-exchequer-surplus-...
Post reply on HN