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Finish your projects

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Re: Finish your projects

#211

Post by doingmaths »

belugacat wrote: post #157
eternityforest wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for mutual aid and sharing, and I am definitely not an endless growth capitalist, I want people to have time and resources to make art and tend their gardens. But I sure couldn't produce the tools I want without making use of the work of profit driven people, simply because advanced tech is a lot of work, takes hundreds of people, is too big for anyone to understand and thus is almost never made if idea-explo…

> Lots of places in Europe seem to have mostly figured the balance out [...] > [...] I don't think I'd prefer to live in a world without Intel and Microsoft Now guess why Intel and Microsoft aren't European companies :)

Mondragon is. You might not be familiar with them, but they are a federation of co-ops in Europe that are a billion dollar business and are the 10th largest industrial group in Spain.

They do R&D, Finance, Manufacturing, and a bunch of other stuff.

https://www.mondragon-corporation.com/en/

There's no axiomatic reason why an Intel or Microsoft couldn't be a co-op or federation of co-ops. It just didn't shake out that way this time.

Re: Finish your projects

#212

Post by emodendroket »

gmiller123456 wrote: post #43
jhp123 wrote: post #30

To take the contrary position: give up. Your project will take far longer than you think, and you will get much less from it than you hope (at least in terms of external validation and rewards). You may feel a horrible pressure to finish it, but you are a free person and can simply choose not to. You can free yourself from this pain without lifting a finger. Go take a walk or bake some cookies instead. If you have th…

Reminds me of The Onion skit where a guy spent 15 years writing a book on ant eaters only to realize it was a horrible waste of time. https://www.google.com/url?q=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv... Sometimes it best to trust your personal prioritization of when and when not to work on a project.

Reminds me of this New Yorker piece about the death of a well-known Sherlock Holmes researcher: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2004/12/13/mysterious-cir...

At the risk of spoiling the surprise, the conclusion rather strongly implied is that he killed himself after coming to feel that he’d wasted his life devoting it to a second-rate author.

Re: Finish your projects

#213

Post by foobiekr »

kaba0 wrote: post #146
foobiekr wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disrupted sleep, lack of REM sleep, poor attentiveness, …

That is very dependent on the consumed quantity, and the time of consumption. And is nothing compared to the next most frequently used drugs, alcohol and nicotine, hell it has plenty of positive effects. So my initial statement I believe still stands that humanity could hardly happen upon another substance that they could use in such a huge amounts with minimal negatives.

You could say the same thing for most amphetamines.

I don't think caffeine is particularly harmful, but it is a huge stretch to paint it as purely beneficial and without side effects. As a point of fact most people getting their "morning jolt" are just treating the side effects of extended caffeine usage - they are physically addicted.

About once a year I spend a month doing no caffeine. Every single year it is quite illuminating to do through first withdrawal and then to experience the first cup of coffee. I recommend it, and you might change some of your thoughts on caffeine if you do this.

Re: Finish your projects

#214

Post by hirvi74 »

bayindirh wrote: post #186
kaba0 wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From most studies I saw, moderate consumption ( Could you expand on what you found and what were the specifics?

I think moderate consumption is a function of tolerance and the specific metabolism of the person combined. I remember reading a comment in HN, where the commenter had a genetic trait which slowed caffeine metabolism by 4 times. So, he had it inside his system 4 times longer, and caffeine had no positive effect on him. However, let's not digress. I'm not a body hacker, and I don't like to mess with my body much, howe…

Have you ever tried Yerba Mate? If so, what do you think about it? I have found it to be similar to green tea and its derivatives, but it seems to have has less pronounced physical effects -- especially compared to coffee.

Re: Finish your projects

#215

Post by mtrower »

bojo wrote: post #135
anoy8888 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look , 90% of good work / product won’t exist if people all give up because they don’t want to grind and only work if they feel like it . You cannot get rid of grinding in any projects even if you are passionate about it . There are gonna be times or parts of it that you need to grind. No excuse if you choose to be a grown up

As a grown up I can choose to enjoy a project until I stop enjoying it. Does every project actually need to be brought to its conclusion? No. Is it nice to take pride in completed projects? Yes. Do the projects I do bring me additional knowledge? Yes, usually. I think that the ability to complete a project is a desirable skill. I think the desire to take a project to completion is worthy, otherwise why start it? Stil…

> Am I not a grown up for making this decision?

No, of course this is not the case. You made a decision based on priorities.

The headline of the article:

> Finish your projects > Don’t let fear, or that last 10%, hold you back.

... and reading the article, it seems targeted at people who want to finish their projects, but are struggling with the reality of actually doing so.

GP seems to be talking about the same sort of thing --- giving up because the going got grindy.

It's of course fine to just screw around in your free time if the goal is to screw around in the first place. It's also fine to realize that some goal (project, etc.) you set no longer aligns with your priorities.

I feel like there are two groups of people here talking about different things but thinking they're the same.

Re: Finish your projects

#216

Post by mtrower »

emodendroket wrote: post #155
anoy8888 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look , 90% of good work / product won’t exist if people all give up because they don’t want to grind and only work if they feel like it . You cannot get rid of grinding in any projects even if you are passionate about it . There are gonna be times or parts of it that you need to grind. No excuse if you choose to be a grown up

I apply that mentality to my job. If I’m just goofing around at home I don’t “have to” do anything.

That's absolutely true. Alternate perspective, though --- might it be that "goofing around" was the goal here, and therefore the goal was accomplished?

Re: Finish your projects

#217

Post by kpennell »

foobiekr wrote: post #138
kaba0 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Caffeine though really is a jackpot for humanity, it has realistically speaking no negative side effects. Even serious physical symptoms from withdrawal are basically just a week of headaches and other minor things.

Disrupted sleep, lack of REM sleep, poor attentiveness, …

FWIW, I kept reading it affects deep sleep, not rem.

Re: Finish your projects

#218

Post by mtrower »

aarondf wrote: post #98
interroboink wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's fascinating seeing the varied (and sometimes quite opposite) replies. I think a good chunk of this comes down to one's personality. I've had an internal notion of "healthy masochism" for a while — much like what you're saying, where pain is part of the process. And if you go through it enough, and taste the final reward enough times, you almost start to feel the pain as a good thing, or a reward on its own. On t…

Yeah everyone is super different, and it is kinda funny to see all the varied replies here. Some of the stories I hold onto when I'm having a tough time finishing are those of writers who talk about what a struggle it is to write. Jerry Seinfeld on the Tim Ferriss show was one of my favorite interviews ever. He talks about about how his advice to young comedians is to just work. There's no way around it. That's been…

I'm thinking maybe it depends on goals?

I don't know what your goals are when you start projects; personally, I seldom start projects just for fun. If it's a program, then it's a tool I want to use. If it's project around the house, it's probably a repair or upgrade that has meaningful impact on my life. It's easy to get discouraged on these kinds of projects, but you have to see them through or in some sense you suffer for it.

In the middle ground there are things you kind of started because you wanted to, to see if you could do it, or because you thought it would be cool. Maybe a drawing you you were working on, or a research project (actually, I don't know if this fits or not). In a home wood shop, maybe you're making an new tool because you enjoy owning nicer tools than you can afford or just tools you made yourself. These projects, you don't really have to finish, but you probably don't want a graveyard full of them either. It's a pride thing. I start projects like this myself on occasion; they end up particularly hard to finish because I have too many of the first type.

Then there are people who are just screwing around, doing what's fun in the moment. I basically never do this, but a lot of people do. Those projects are fine as well, but people doing that sort of thing are going to have a very different outlook.

Re: Finish your projects

#219

Post by JohnFen »

interroboink wrote: post #11

In general, I like the empathetic tone of the article, and I appreciate that it addresses an emotional facet of software development. But nevertheless it triggers some little part of me w/regard to telling people what they should or should not do, or what they may be proud of. I worry for someone who reads "You also have a duty to your future self to release the project" and "...you tell yourself that you are the kin…

Yes, I'm more than a little allergic to that sort of tone as well. But I take it more as he's saying out loud what he says to himself for motivation.

These are things that are important to him. His advice and tone may be of use to others who share his values. Those that don't should feel perfectly fine with ignoring him or (better) reinterpreting what he's saying so it better aligns with their own set of values.

Re: Finish your projects

#220

Post by JohnFen »

SanderNL wrote: post #208
latexr wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My tiny life sometimes overwhelms me already. Because you (presumably) have to deal with every tiny thing in your life. Even having to buy and cook food can feel overwhelming when you’re busy trying to accomplish other things. Marcus Aurelius had slaves. He was the emperor. He did not have to worry about the multitude of minutiae required just to continue to exist. When it seems to you rich people are able to achie…

No, because I am less capable. It’s sometimes simple like that. He wasn’t “rich people” like some Russian oligarch. He had shit to do and deep moral obligations. Millions of lives depended on it. Things of vast strategic importance stretching both thousands of miles and many decades. Slaves don’t manage your long term ambitions and juggle your various mental and moral anguishes. They keep your house clean and provide…

> No, because I am less capable

You know yourself better than I, obviously, but if you're assuming that because your path differs from theirs, I think you should have some doubt that the difference is because you are less capable. It may be that you have different values.

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