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Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

teslamotors.com

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Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#211

Post by scott_s »

ugh wrote: post #207
scott_s wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That may be true, but it's orthogonal to the point I was responding to, which was "You shouldn't need to read a manual to drive a car." The only reason that statement holds with gas-based cars is that the things one needs to do to take care of them is common knowledge. New technologies have new quirks, and those who adopt them will have to read the manual. Eventually, when the technology becomes common, how to take c…

Which is the only perspective that matters for the company.

Which is a fine position to have, but a non-sequitur in this discussion.

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#212

Post by krallja »

jws wrote: post #135
jellicle wrote: post #124

Tesla, what's the cost of bundling a solar trickle charger in with your vehicle? Either build it into the roof (next generation, obviously) or just buy one that sits on the dashboard and throw it in with purchase. "Please to be using this when leaving vehicle at airport. Thank you much, Tesla." Maybe there's some reason this won't work, but... you need to work with your customers' expectations. Some of them are going…

30 watt drain. You will need 720 watt hours per day which will be around a square meter of solar cells. Won't work in the parking garage, snow, or Seattle. Just don't leave your tesla at the airport of 12 weeks. That's expensive all by itself.

Do you need the full 30W to keep the battery alive, or is that for the whole electrical system on standby?

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#213

Post by snowwrestler »

aero142 wrote: post #139

Why is this thread so filled with hate? This all sounds very reasonable to me. They clearly acknowledge that the battery must be maintained properly and they seem to be doing to the right things to minimize the risk. They then show very clearly that the total amount of maintenance is less than that of a gasoline vehicle, w/ oil and scheduled maintenance. There are a bunch of things like breaking your timing belt that…

A surprising number of people, even within the technology field, don't like change that disrupts their personal habits. Hence the constant low-intensity warfare over the various Linux distros and interfaces.

In this case a lot of folks are getting emotionally involved because this story serves as proof that electric cars can't be maintained with the exact same habits that an ICE car is maintained. Habits are a personal things, and can be difficult to change. A lot of people will fight to preserve them rather than adapt them.

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#215

Post by outworlder »

ceejayoz wrote: post #16
redthrowaway wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really no different than early fuel-injected cars being damaged by running out of gas. The solution? Don't run out of fucking gas. That didn't stop fuel injection from becoming the dominant technology, and neither will this halt the rise of EVs.

> It's really no different than early fuel-injected cars being damaged by running out of gas. Barring a fuel leak, your car won't run out of gas sitting in your garage while you're on a long business trip.

It will not run out of gas. But it can - and will - get damaged if sitting unattended for too long.

It might be the tires (check your owner's manual!), it might be the AC (again, manual - it should be turned on from time to time), you might now notice a strange smoke due to new oil leaks inside the combustion chamber, it might make horrible noises for a couple of seconds (because the oil drained to the bottom of the engine), etc, etc.

Hell, last extended trip we went on, we had someone to start the engines (and the damn AC) for a few minutes at least every week. It is just good practice.

If indeed the battery management system on a Tesla is able to keep the batteries alive for months at 0% reported charge, then it is a non-issue. Noone is going to leave such a car unattended for months, really. Specially if it is a Roadster.

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#216

Post by outworlder »

Assuming Tesla PR is correct, then:

1- All modern battery packs, including laptops, have internal management circuitry that, among other things (like controlling charge so that they will not explode) not allow the damn thing to deplete. When 0% charge is reported the battery still has plenty of juice left.

2- With the given parasitic drain, the battery will last for at least a month left at 0% charge

3- If you leave you car at the airport, you kinda expect to be able to get back, so you won't leave the car at 0% when you depart. And even at 0%, you have a month to plug it in

So, barring a zombie apocalypse, what is the expected use-case that actual owners would encounter, to be able to destroy the batteries? It is certainly not normal usage.

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#217

Post by outworlder »

redthrowaway wrote: post #5
URSpider94 wrote: post #2

This is PR mastery. Nowhere in the release does Tesla refute that owners have "bricked" their batteries. Nowhere in the release do they say that the battery can not be bricked by leaving it for a long period without a recharge. All they say is that it would take a period of weeks for a Tesla roadster to reach 0% charge, and that the Model S has battery disconnect technology that can extend this to several months. The…

It's really no different than early fuel-injected cars being damaged by running out of gas. The solution? Don't run out of fucking gas. That didn't stop fuel injection from becoming the dominant technology, and neither will this halt the rise of EVs.

Interesting fact: I managed to break the fuel pump on my Ford Ka by running the car for too long with low fuel.

Apparently, some fuel pumps are cooled by the fuel itself. If the level gets too low, it can't dissipate the heat fast enough and the pump fails.

It didn't "brick" right away, but it got increasingly harder to start, because the pump could no longer pressurise que fuel line fast enough.

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#218

Post by eduardordm »

grellas wrote: post #200

Deposition line of questioning suggested after reading this piece: Q. Is it true that the battery has catastrophic failure when it drains to zero and is left in that state for a sustained period? A. The company has built in countless safeguards to ensure that the battery never drains to zero. Q. That is not what I asked. Please answer the question. A. It is an unfounded rumor that many owners have incurred such a cat…

Answer to your first question: No. The battery is fine, the stupidity in understanding that Li-ion batteries must never be fully discharged is the only catastrophic failure here.

Why can't I down vote your post? :(

PS: Don't buy any RC model (or diesel engines!), they all suffer from the same "catastrophic failure".

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#219

Post by outworlder »

fletchowns wrote: post #61
tocomment wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did they resolve this with modern fuel injected cars? I routinely drive mine until it runs out of gas (don't ask) and I haven't had any adverse problems.

I've heard that can be really hard on your fuel pump.

I commented above about this, it actually happened to my car. The pump overheated.

There were some natural gas kits sold that would not disable the fuel pump when you switched to gas. Some owners, when running out of gasoline, would switch to the gas. The fuel pump would keep running dry and melt. Something like this: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_WafeVL7IZss/S5VP0fVNvuI/AAAAAAAAJP...

Re: Tesla responds to "bricking" issue

#220

Post by droithomme »

redthrowaway wrote: post #208
droithomme wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you agree, as we all do, that if you do what the "blogger starting an unfounded rumor" describes, then you will brick the car, as he claims will be the result. So you agree the blogger is telling the truth and the PR release from tesla is a lie, correct?

This is the second time[1] you have said precisely the same thing in response to a comment of mine in this thread. I don't care about whatever agenda you're trying to push; stop being so belligerent in your attempts to get me to say something completely orthogonal to my point. [1] The other: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3631295

So you agree the blogger is telling the truth and the PR release from tesla is a lie, correct?
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