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The Never Married, a New Normal

psychologytoday.com

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Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#211

Post by jitl »

falcolas wrote: post #61
jitl wrote: post #10

My partner and I have been together for 7 years, we bought a house together, haven’t found a compelling reason to get married. Marriage is a complex and binding contract that for two high earners is a tax disadvantage. The most prominent benefits I’ve learned are some situations around visitation rights, and avoiding being compelled to testify against your spouse. It comes from a very dubious history of the husband e…

One benefit I feel towards being married: those visitation rights. I’ve seen others refused entrance alongside their partners in the hospital, and it’s a heartbreak I’ve never had to experience myself. I also appreciate how I have a partner against this world, legally and emotionally.

Where I live, you can file a “declaration of domestic partnership” online to receive those rights: https://www.miamidade.gov/global/license.page?Mduid_license=...

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#212

Post by Saigonautica »

Looking at the first 3 causes they list, that's pretty much my wife and I.

I'm an immigrant to Asia, so got my life in reasonable order a bit later than most (picking up and moving across the world will do that). Early marriage in a culture I didn't fit in to yet, would have been a terrible idea. I hear lots of disaster stories in this domain!

We decided to ignore local cultural norms and share a residence before marriage. This was in hindsight a wise decision that let us build a life together in confidence.

I had my immigration paperwork properly in order before we met, but had not yet made any real money. We were both pretty broke, at the time. We held separate finances at the start, but shared expenses, which improved our financial security quite a bit.

Honestly, we would have continued this way and ignored pressure to get married... except that it's somewhat difficult for me to gain citizenship. Without citizenship, no land/home ownership or access to many financial instruments -- so it's optimal that I hand over 100% of any income. Marriage provides me with at least a few rights in this context (at least de jure), so we went for it.

It was simply the least suboptimal choice. I feel if it wasn't for the weird legal context of being an immigrant to a country that receives few immigrants (Vietnam), we may not have bothered getting married, social pressures be damned.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#213

Post by warmwaffles »

jitl wrote: post #10

My partner and I have been together for 7 years, we bought a house together, haven’t found a compelling reason to get married. Marriage is a complex and binding contract that for two high earners is a tax disadvantage. The most prominent benefits I’ve learned are some situations around visitation rights, and avoiding being compelled to testify against your spouse. It comes from a very dubious history of the husband e…

> Marriage is a complex and binding contract that for two high earners is a tax disadvantage.

You can file separately.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#214

Post by JenrHywy »

zeroxp wrote: post #175
cultofmetatron wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Yes, marriage is about trust. Trust makes you vulnerable, but it opens up a lot of life that just isnt possible otherwise.

Wonderfully put.

I met my (now) wife after a long relationship that'd ended somewhat messily. I made the conscious decision to go all-in on the new relationship because it could not possibly be what I wanted it to be if I didn't.

My wife and I were married about 5 months after meeting. My friends and family were worried that I was leaving myself vulnerable to being wiped out emotionally and financially if the marriage didn't work out. They were right, in a way. But sabotaging the relationship on order to stay safe seemed a far worse risk.

We're coming up on 18 years of marriage, so I'm glad I made that call. In an alternativee timeline where this relationship had failed, I'd like to think I'd still go all-in subsequently, but I can see how it would get harder and harder with each failed attempt.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#215

Post by lotsofpulp »

TheCoelacanth wrote: post #174
cultofmetatron wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Marriage itself is not really more of a risk to a man than a woman. Shared property from the marriage will get divided up, but that affects women the same as men. Having children is a slight risk because custody is a bit more likely to be given to women than men, so men are a bit more likely to have to pay child support. Having a spouse who stops working to take care of children is a large risk for both partners. One…

> Having children is a slight risk because custody is a bit more likely to be given to women than men, so men are a bit more likely to have to pay child support.

Having a child is also more than a slight risk to the woman whose body is put through drastic change with unpredictable consequences and are still expected to keep working the same as before.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#216

Post by nunez »

throwaway1492 wrote: post #49

I’ll risk it and defend marriage to this crowd. To me getting married was about getting out of myself. As someone who got married later in life, I’d spent decades living only for myself, doing what I wanted to do when I wanted to do it. Relationships were shallow and lasted only so long as convenient. By choosing to get married and intentional build a family, I knew I was sacrificing a lot of ego and choosing to give…

Agreed; 100%.

Being married has been awesome. Best decision I ever made.

Some days are hard, sure, but that's part of living with someone who is not you. We come out as better people in the end.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#217

Post by nunez »

cultofmetatron wrote: post #142
throwaway1492 wrote: post #49

I’ll risk it and defend marriage to this crowd. To me getting married was about getting out of myself. As someone who got married later in life, I’d spent decades living only for myself, doing what I wanted to do when I wanted to do it. Relationships were shallow and lasted only so long as convenient. By choosing to get married and intentional build a family, I knew I was sacrificing a lot of ego and choosing to give…

[flagged]

> society as completely absolved women of all responsibilities as a wife

Please elaborate.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#218

Post by jahewson »

cultofmetatron wrote: post #142
throwaway1492 wrote: post #49

I’ll risk it and defend marriage to this crowd. To me getting married was about getting out of myself. As someone who got married later in life, I’d spent decades living only for myself, doing what I wanted to do when I wanted to do it. Relationships were shallow and lasted only so long as convenient. By choosing to get married and intentional build a family, I knew I was sacrificing a lot of ego and choosing to give…

[flagged]

I’m gonna stick my neck out and say that a man getting divorced did not, in fact, do everything right.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#219

Post by xupybd »

adam_arthur wrote: post #156
emodendroket wrote: post #127

> Cohabitation has become a popular alternative; living together is a less complicated relationship model that comes with an easy escape hatch (compared with marriage) if the relationship fails This seems like a bit of a false promise... Once you commingle finances, own a house together, have children, and so on, there's no "easy escape hatch." Plus thinking of having an "easy escape hatch" probably does not do wonde…

Why commingle finances at all? A large percentage of divorces are due to financial disagreements... joint accounts have proven to be a failed model at scale. If you want to share money, have separate accounts and transfer money between them as needed/on a schedule. No room for impropriety/mistrust. Everybody has autonomy. If we choose to be realistic, rather than idealistic, we would recognize that a large percentage…

> Why commingle finances at all?

If you have children I'm not sure how you can avoid this. You have to share the care of the kids. One of you is going to take a hit in your earnings. Be that in extra sick days or for her the maternity leave. I don't think you can account for the work sharing evenly, so I don't think it's fair to try and account for the financial sharing.

Re: The Never Married, a New Normal

#220

Post by than3 »

adam_arthur wrote: post #156
emodendroket wrote: post #127

> Cohabitation has become a popular alternative; living together is a less complicated relationship model that comes with an easy escape hatch (compared with marriage) if the relationship fails This seems like a bit of a false promise... Once you commingle finances, own a house together, have children, and so on, there's no "easy escape hatch." Plus thinking of having an "easy escape hatch" probably does not do wonde…

Why commingle finances at all? A large percentage of divorces are due to financial disagreements... joint accounts have proven to be a failed model at scale. If you want to share money, have separate accounts and transfer money between them as needed/on a schedule. No room for impropriety/mistrust. Everybody has autonomy. If we choose to be realistic, rather than idealistic, we would recognize that a large percentage…

> A large percentage of divorces are due to financial disagreements.

That's putting it delicately.

Quite a number of judges have straight out ruled that prenuptial agreements are not binding making this a free for all. The resulting judicial caused disaster often is what's catastrophic as opportunism shines through.

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