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Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

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Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#211

Post by twojacobtwo »

hd4 wrote: post #138
tokyolights2 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and from your own desires As a non-religious gay I probably wasn't invited anyway. But this kind of thinking is what leads conservatives to so much repression and hate. The idea that the wants and needs of your body are something which the mind must actively fight. That the scratchy, ill-fitting wool sweater of your culture is something that you must keep on at all costs. And it leads to resentment of people who ar…

That sounds like you're coming at this from a similar standpoint to one of the other major religions which I would rather not mention as I don't want to start a religious war here. In Islam you're not hated or judged for what you call your true feelings. You are however instructed to gain mastery over those feelings and make them subordinate to you rather than the other way around. Fasting is one of the things that c…

>you are seen as a blank slate

To me, this is just another angle of what the parent comment was talking about. We are not blank slates. We have millions of years of evolutionary instinct and genetics/epigenetics built into us AND we have everything we are fed (literally and figuratively) affecting us before we even get a chance to start thinking about 'who' or 'what' we are.

The blank slate line of thinking is what conservatives in the US implicitly (or explicitly) use to make the claim that being gay is a choice. It seems that it's just another way to justify punishing people for things that may be beyond their control, because if we are blank slates, then everything about you is your own fault.

Obviously there are aspects about ourselves that we can change, but the blank slate ideal is a dangerous slope to slide down.

>You are however instructed to gain mastery over those feelings and make them subordinate to you rather than the other way around

Genuine question: How is this different from saying "it's not bad to be gay, it's just bad to not repress your feelings and never act on them", as is a common (paraphrased) refrain among those who are anti-lgbt?

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#212

Post by sterlind »

H8crilA wrote: post #161
thuridas wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a shame that it didn't lead them to stop smoking

People underappreciate how addictive nicotine is. I've been an addict for 15 years and I quit so many times, sometimes for longer than a year. The new smoking inventions only make it worse because they allow for much much higher dosages. I've seen teens smoking what amounts to 10 packs a day worth of nicotine. And they didn't have to chain smoke for 12 hours to achieve that.

aww that's scary. I managed to quit smoking years ago (I only smoked for less than a year anyway), then quit vaping, then used nicotine lozenges for an embarrassingly long amount of time (4+ years?) until quitting cold-turkey at the start of this year.

do you think I'll relapse? I don't usually get cravings anymore but I'm scared it'll happen.

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#213

Post by mkoubaa »

throw1234651234 wrote: post #79

Questions to understand better: 1. Is the practioner supposed to abstain from "bad" things in the evening after breaking the fast or is it just during the day? What's the hardline, "accepted", and commonly practices answer to this? 2. Is the big dinner party thing on the last day of fasting or the subsequent day? 3. Do people get gifts, when?

"Supposed to" is not the language I'd use. People feel motivated given their self control for food and water and are encouraged to try and use that momentum to also be better people.

In my personal experience as a compulsive snacker being able to fast daily for a month makes me feel like I can do anything

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#214

Post by mardifoufs »

beebmam wrote: post #71
JumpinJack_Cash wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> > enforced by law in some countries "Enforced by law"...if you want to eat in the privacy of your home that's between yourself and Allah. And besides...lockdowns were also enforced by law, but the law will never have enough men to police all the population, it would require a 1:1 ratio or thereabout. That's why the physical world is important as opposed to the virtual world where the ratio can be reduced drasticall…

I think the point is: should we really be enforcing religious laws in our societies? Seems deeply coercive and unethical

You can eat in practically every muslim country during ramadan, if you aren't muslim. It will be hard to find open restaurants during the day, but no one will bother a non-muslim about eating openly.

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#215

Post by verbify »

mardifoufs wrote: post #193
rsynnott wrote: post #98

I was unaware until this year that it was based on when the moon was _sighted_, not just on a conventional lunar calendar. This leads to very short notice public holidays in a couple of countries AIUI.

I'm muslim but I never understood why that is the case. Surely the lunar calendar/phases/characteristics must be easy to reliably predict?

Moon 'sighting' is much earlier than the Islamic tradition. It's discussed in the Mishna, so it was at least debated in the 2nd century CE: https://www.sefaria.org/Mishnah_Rosh_Hashanah.2?lang=bi

The charitable case is that while something might be predictable, it's our conscious interaction that's important to these religions, not the theoretical knowledge.

The uncharitable case is that religions derive a lot of power from being able to fix time, and this demonstrates their sovereignty over people's lives in this sphere.

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#216

Post by counttheforks »

hd4 wrote: post #156
counttheforks wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you are saying they are invited as long as they are willing to endure people trying to change them?

No I didn't say that at all, and that's a petulant response honestly. Re-read my comment. I said Islam instructs people to make their feelings subordinate to them rather than the other way around. The other replies to the GP were not so different from what I'm saying. You're hardly required to state your sexual orientation each time you pray, if that's the sort of line of reasoning you're taking here.

Perhaps I misunderstood you? What did you mean with

> instead you are seen as a blank slate and whatever actions you do impact your life here and the life hereafter

I assumed you meant that people will be welcomed because they are a blank slate that can be written upon by those seeking to influence them.

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#217

Post by tppiotrowski »

twen_ty wrote: post #150
tppiotrowski wrote: post #87

It seems like there is a geographical bound on practicing (Orthodox?) Muslims. I imagine past 66.5 degrees of latitude, someone fasting would probably die due to the fact that the sun will never rise for a month. Has there been any debate or clarification on how Muslims living in complete darkness are to practice? Edit: sun will never set/living in 24 hour sunlight. The fasting time is during daylight hours.

Have a look at this - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6vfsYwXW6I . The most misunderstood part about Islam is that how practical the religion is - Islam expects believers to give it their best shot, within reason and without being judged by some rigid binary rule. It's perfectly okay to not fast for 22 hours and it's also okay if you can make it. Islam prioritizes health and well being.

Great video. Thank you. A good reminder that religious practices are like human beings. You can try to generalize, but in the end each person's faith is unique in some way.

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#218

Post by hd4 »

twojacobtwo wrote: post #211
hd4 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds like you're coming at this from a similar standpoint to one of the other major religions which I would rather not mention as I don't want to start a religious war here. In Islam you're not hated or judged for what you call your true feelings. You are however instructed to gain mastery over those feelings and make them subordinate to you rather than the other way around. Fasting is one of the things that c…

>you are seen as a blank slate To me, this is just another angle of what the parent comment was talking about. We are not blank slates. We have millions of years of evolutionary instinct and genetics/epigenetics built into us AND we have everything we are fed (literally and figuratively) affecting us before we even get a chance to start thinking about 'who' or 'what' we are. The blank slate line of thinking is what c…

To clarify, a blank state in your relationship with God. Like, you aren't judged for being a certain sexual way until you actually act on it (or choose to not act on it).

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#219

Post by mardifoufs »

mkoubaa wrote: post #197
mardifoufs wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm muslim but I never understood why that is the case. Surely the lunar calendar/phases/characteristics must be easy to reliably predict?

I and many others use calculations but some folks prefer the traditional method

Ah so it is just a preference? Is there usually an actual difference on when Eid is between the final "traditional" observation and the predicted calculations?

Re: Tell HN: Eid Mubarak

#220

Post by roarcher »

codersfocus wrote: post #139
elashri wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes there is two main opinions for scholars. The first one is obvious, people in this place follow the fasting time of the nearest place that have sound sunrise/sunset times. The other is to follow the fasting times of mecca.

[flagged]

"Now that I've condescended to you, I expect you to let that be the last word."

I'm not religious, but your comment ought to be engraved on a monument to pomposity.

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