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Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

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Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#211
After living next to an AirBNB for 3 years in a quiet neighborhood, good riddance.

If you haven't had the pleasure, having an AirBNB next door is like having your house moved to a cheap hotel parking lot. Random yelling and screaming at odd hours, parties every holiday (even the minor ones), lots of middle of the night loud drunken discussions. Random people all the time, is that guy trying to break into my house or is he trying to get into the AirBNB back yard. Questions, where's a good place to eat, where is the water hose, how do you like living here, do you know of a late night pharmacy nearby?

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#212
It occurs to me that the very existence of Airbnb(and so many other startups that offer cheaper alternatives) is a grift on people who can’t afford the real cost of travel and vacations.

As usual, the companies make money and the product is the economically strained consumer. We see this kind of grift everywhere from car sales to real estate interest rates where poor people and people of colour are targeted because they want something more than they can afford.

Everyone is always looking for a deal or something cheaper even when they don’t have to..and there are others who have been conned into parting with the few dollars they have because they have been convinced that they deserve a certain experience even if it’s sub par.

The only way to deal with this societal malnutrition is to find joy in everything. Example: The notion that one has to go on a family vacation annually like it’s a sacred vow pilgrimage is a uniquely western phenomenon. and a seemingly recent one.

Something strange has been happening recently. The attachment to material things has somehow made people blind to reality. Their own reality. The reality of their wallets.

Consumers in the west are not the true poor, but due to social media and some perverted sense of entitlement, they want the experiences of gazillionaires. Which makes them artificially poor. Quantity over quality is the first indication that one is living with a sense of lack or scarcity.

But I don’t understand the new found middle class obsession with luxury at cheap deals. Never has anyone in the world lived in such abundance. No one has childhood memories of overseas travels or annual cruises or vacations. So this must be a planted desire. It’s not real. The Airbnb customer is the product. Consumers minds are just fertile grounds where unreasonable expectations are seeded. Hence the wild chase for something cheaper.

The first priority for any vacation stay should be safety and then cleanliness and then comfort. The reviewing system and site should be independent.

But that’s a long game. Companies that want to stay forever put in such controls. Short grifts don’t have to worry because in a Ponzi scheme, the people at the top would have made the money early on well before the decay and rot sets in the balance sheet.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#213
post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You make a great point about the (de)evolution of marketplaces. Does anyone have any thoughts about how marketplace operations could prevent this sort of race to the bottom rot? It does kind of feel like an inevitability these days and I wonder if there’s a real solution. I suppose part of the problem is that the growth-at-all-costs mentality exists in conflict of quality-at-all-costs. Maybe the answer is just to sta…

Regulations. Put regulations on the Market Places to tighten up their process for accepting new sellers, and direct punishment of the Market Places themselves for selling bad products. These Market Places have no skin in the game when it comes to the stuff they sell, they need a reason to care. If they care, these problems start to sort themselves out. For example, instead of just fining the AirBNB host for an illega…

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Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#214
post #191

It's not surprising at all. All of these review-driven P2P marketplace businesses end up with the same problem. After the initial phase of early adopters that offer generally high quality products, a flood of fake or low-quality listing tries to squeeze money out of the platform. These people are not listing their homes on Airbnb, they are trying to make a living by extracting as much money from the platform as they…

You make a great point about the (de)evolution of marketplaces. Does anyone have any thoughts about how marketplace operations could prevent this sort of race to the bottom rot? It does kind of feel like an inevitability these days and I wonder if there’s a real solution. I suppose part of the problem is that the growth-at-all-costs mentality exists in conflict of quality-at-all-costs. Maybe the answer is just to sta…

I think you need to consider both parties:

1. The incentives of the platform

2. The incentives of the individual

For 1, a big part of the problem is the growth-at-all-costs mindset coming from VC incentives. In this case, having more hosts and deleting bad reviews directly helps the platform because it increases the market size and short-term profitability. You could argue that it hurts in the long-term when quality drops to unacceptable levels, but most companies don't care about that. Founders have already exited and executives have gotten paid. Also, by not growing quickly you're vulnerable to competitors that do grow more quickly. The only solution that comes to mind is to not have for-profit entities where founders/VC get rich behind these kind of platforms. It needs to be fully community-driven.

For 2, I think it's about skin in the game and trust. In many industries you can't go out and scam people without facing serious consequences. On these online platform you can, but you don't face real consequences. It's just another ban. Regulation with serious fines or jail time is one solution. Another solution is a (hypothetical) world where online identity is connected across services and tied to your real identity. Imagine getting a bad review on Airbnb actually has real-life consequences because it's tied to your identity. Perhaps that's what you get with the CCP, where people's online accounts for many services are associated with their government identities. I'm not saying these are desirable solutions, but they certainly would deter hosts from trying to game the system.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#215
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. I can only hope the tide is turning and these AirBnBs will be back in the hands of the people who actually live in the cities. Sadly corporations will probably eat them up and let, though hopefully as long-term instead of short!

> will be back in the hands of the people who actually live in the cities. There apparently is a real demand to rent such places for short terms like holidays or trips. Banning AirBnB, or AirBnB going down, won't remove that demand.

There's a real demand, but at one point the cost becomes too steep.

The cleaning and service fees are being universally complained about. It definitely reduced some demand, especially since some of it seemed to have started recently - last year ?

For long weekends, it becomes a very bad deal: the overhead of big service fees that are usually more than 1 day's rental, then you tack on the cleaning which can be 125-225 typically. You put those numbers together and sure, while there's demand, the demand is mitigated by the high cost. There's a demand for all sorts of consumer items in the world but people hit their limits.

And fundamentally, Airbnb competes with hotels. Their niche is to provide a better hotel experience: a bigger space, maybe a backyard, and definitely a kitchen. But many would rather go back to the tiny fridges filled with pricey junk food they never touch, if it means saving hundreds of dollars a weekend and flexible cancellation policies.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#216

It's not surprising at all. All of these review-driven P2P marketplace businesses end up with the same problem. After the initial phase of early adopters that offer generally high quality products, a flood of fake or low-quality listing tries to squeeze money out of the platform. These people are not listing their homes on Airbnb, they are trying to make a living by extracting as much money from the platform as they…

But it's also Airbnb themselves. It's well known that negative reviews are scrubbed and even edited, this is something many people including myself have experienced. Any doubts, spend some time on the Airbnb subreddit, which is run by hosts, and check out both their attitudes and their advice about how to remove bad reviews. Airbnb needs hosts for its revenue. Clients are the product. I used to love Airbnb and used i…

> 225 in cleaning fees

Ah yes, and then you read in the notes that you also have to do the laundry and wash the dishes.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#217
Researching the host isn't part of people's normal Airbnb booking process? Eek.

I always click into the host details, check for additional listings, check their history, and usually try to street-view the property as well (harder to do for apartments, but usually possible for full homes).

It's annoying that I have to do it. No question Airbnb should do a better job ensuring their listings are legitimate. But, when I travel, I almost always need a kitchen and someplace that's dog-friendly, which rules out most hotels.

Maybe I've just been lucky, but across most of the eastern US, Scotland, Italy, and Iceland, I've had good experiences. I generally pick a mid-priced listing, not the cheapest, and definitely not the most expensive.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#218

I don't think the interesting part of this article is that there are bad AirBnB hosts. I'm sure there are. I don't think they are the majority, and I'm basing that on my overwhelmingly positive experiences as a guest. So, that part of the article doesn't ring true to me. The interesting part is how much of a hellish experience AirBnB support was. If you're staying in an AirBnB, you likely do not have the time to spen…

This. A bad AirBNB can affect a customers health and safety. How can they justify taking days to come to a resolution?

In this case I also wonder why the author didn’t take faster action themselves. Immediately move out into a new hotel or rental and sort out a refund later.

Probably the root cause to both inaction is money.

Airbnb doesn’t want to pay for a prompt help desk and for a customer friendly refund Policy.

The customer doesn’t want to or can’t pay for a market rate hotel.

This makes me far less likely to trust airbnb for long term rentals myself, knowing you can’t trust that listings are authentic and that you can’t count on airbnb to help if you get duped.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#219

Yep. Had an Airbnb setup this week in Atlanta, looked good, responsive host. We arrived, looked clean and decorated well enough, but had 4 glade plugins for a 500sqft place… seemed excessive like their might be a bad smell hidden. Sat down on a chaise which collapsed because of a leg attached by gum. Found a cockroach under said chaise. Reported it and the owner said it was treated the other day, so it should be fine…

> Airbnbs can be nice and give you a real sense of being a resident of a place

I really don't get this. If you're vacationing there's no way you'll feel anywhere near a "sense of being a resident". It's vacations, you're a tourist, there's nothing wrong with that. I don't get what about the "experience" of a regular Airbnb is better than staying at a decent hotel.

Of course this does not apply to exotic Airbnbs.

Re: Illegal host, electric shocks, slugs, leaks and no support – How Airbnb failed

#220
post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My sister uses AirBnB quite frequently because her and her partner are both Vegan. Having a kitchen is a big advantage over hotels.

There are suite hotels with kitchenettes if that's a priority.

Unfortunately suite hotels are usually outrageously expensive
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