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Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

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Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#211

Post by s1artibartfast »

turkishmonky wrote: post #196
jhanschoo wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, this observation must be qualified as not necessarily generalizable to all teenagers and parents. Sometimes a person may grow up and realize that their parents were indeed quite lacking, and be right in that assessment. I think this other circumstance is important to at least mention because children of objectively lacking parents can have doubts in their mind about their own judgment. In part beca…

Those types of generalization have always been troublesome for me - While I admit I was an idiot as a kid, the respect I had for my parents has decreased even further the older I get. I understand more and more how harmful their behaviors were for me as a child, and have been intentional about not falling into the same behaviors with my kids. Some parents are just really really inadequate or abusive as parents.

The heuristic can be reworded as adult parents are more knowledgeable and capable than children.

Put the average child in the position of the average parent and you will see the difference.

Think of how abusive the average parent is, then imagine them trying to parent with 10-20 years less development.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#212

Post by nicoburns »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #202
financetechbro wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stupid parents are very much everywhere

But stupidity is relative and stupid children are more common. The heuristic can be reworded as adult parents are more knowledgeable and capable than children. Put the average child in the position of the average parent and you will see the difference.

> The heuristic can be reworded as adult parents are more knowledgeable and capable than children.

I think that's true in general, but when it comes to making decisions about the child I think that has to be weighted against another heuristic that's often but not always true: that people know what's best for themselves better than other people do. I think people often wrongly neglect that principle when it comes to children assuming that they don't know what they're talking about without taking the time to listen and understand their point.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#213

Post by titanomachy »

webmobdev wrote: post #103
civilized wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure it's theoretically possible to do poorly in a class because the teacher didn't like you, but statistically, it's got to be one of the most powerful red flags on a human. Steer clear.

I didn't get you; steer clear of who - the teacher or the student?

probably steer clear of the student who claims they failed because the teacher didn't like them

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#214

Post by turkishmonky »

Ntrails wrote: post #188
beebeepka wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is an excellent point. Yes, usually parents do "what is best for their children". However, good intentions do not guarantee good results. It took me 20 years to undo some of the more direct damage done to me by forcing me into a path I didn't want. Parents being completely wrong for the right reasons is very much a thing. That doesn't even count psychological damage almost guaranteed to lurk in there pretty much…

I think people find it very easy to judge parenting from the outside and/or with hindsight, whether their own or other peoples. I know that my children will wish I did things differently. Whether that is location, discipline, activities, internet access etc etc. I know they will wish I made more reasoned choices in the moment. That I was never tired, distracted, frustrated. That I let them spend their time as they wi…

I fully expect to make many mistakes as a parent, and there's a lot of things I could have done better.

As a child though, many decisions my parents made were with the view of demonizing outside groups and "protecting" their kids from any contrarian viewpoints. Catching up socially took years, and there are some extreme harms that I still deal with to this day. My goal is to make sure my kids have a well-rounded social life, a consideration for others, and an understanding of a gamut of ideas.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#215

Post by pbhjpbhj »

brightball wrote: post #57
warner25 wrote: post #10

I've often thought the same thing about becoming an adult, especially a parent, in general. There are so many choices that I harshly judged older people for making (how to allocate their time and money, where to live, what to allow or not allow the kids to do, how to behave at work, etc.) that I now find myself making as a married guy in my mid-30s with four kids. It makes me sad, but on each point I'm like, "Oh, now…

Yep. Your point of view as a parent is often very different than as a teen/20-ager. Different priorities. You’re suddenly aware of all of the things in society influencing your kids. You’re very aware when things your read online don’t match up with reality and especially with math. It’s just life experience. I don’t know many parents who look back at their younger years thinking, “I had it all figured out back then.…

More age, and requisite life-experience, changes you as a parent. In some ways it's better, in some ways it's worse. I've been a better parent and a worse parent for my younger children - IMO 30-32 is/was the right age to get balance in these things.

I expect that differs by cultural setting, nationality, etc..

Couple of examples: I'm less hot-headed as I age; I'm less physically able (much more than I expected).

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#216

Post by slaymaker1907 »

As a student for many years, I completely agree I would not prepare as well without some stakes in the homework. However, using those super precise instructions can be harmful to students. It's very difficult for me as someone with ADHD to follow these instructions and not miss something.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#217

Post by cnelsenmilt »

warner25 wrote: post #99
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What’s wrong with doing the things that your more mature, logical self actually wants instead of what your younger, uninformed self thought you’d want? There’s nothing stopping you from eating ice cream for breakfast, spending all of your money on Lamborghinis, and playing video games all day. As an adult you realize that those things won’t actually bring you true happiness and those decisions will cause significant…

The root of it, for me, is that most of my choices as I grow older are compromises for the sake of ease, or from of a sense of obligation to my wife and kids. Like I recognize that different, harder choices could make me richer, or leaner, or more accomplished, or whatever, but I'm often exhausted and such choices would often be harder on everyone else in the family too. So rather than ice cream and Lamborghinis and…

I feel ya. As a childless person of the same age, I have several of those things you mentioned. I count them as blessings but also see that there has been a big, big trade made for them. I see that my siblings have made different choices with different blessings. I suppose this is just life.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#218

Post by zamfi »

Ntrails wrote: post #188
beebeepka wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is an excellent point. Yes, usually parents do "what is best for their children". However, good intentions do not guarantee good results. It took me 20 years to undo some of the more direct damage done to me by forcing me into a path I didn't want. Parents being completely wrong for the right reasons is very much a thing. That doesn't even count psychological damage almost guaranteed to lurk in there pretty much…

I think people find it very easy to judge parenting from the outside and/or with hindsight, whether their own or other peoples. I know that my children will wish I did things differently. Whether that is location, discipline, activities, internet access etc etc. I know they will wish I made more reasoned choices in the moment. That I was never tired, distracted, frustrated. That I let them spend their time as they wi…

> Being well intentioned is a bloody good start.

This sadly depends a lot on the community. Being well-intentioned but misinformed in fundamental ways can cause a lot of harm.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#219

Post by b3morales »

skybrian wrote: post #90
temp8964 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's an author I read a lot who repeatedly makes a point in this writing: there are things in my writing you won't be able to understand before you get older, there is just no way. I have to say, it is so true. There are layers of layers I can only see when I get older. Remember when you are a teenage in high school and teachers explain subtle messages in the reading? You and all your classmates are like: this is…

Which author?

I don't know if this is who parent meant, but it's certainly one of C.S. Lewis's not-so-subtle themes in the Chronicles of Narnia.

Re: Teaching is a slow process of becoming everything you hate

#220

Post by ryandrake »

raverbashing wrote: post #115
finexplained wrote: post #6

This perfectly describes my experience as a TA in graduate school. At first I didn't understand why my advisor insisted on being so precise in assignment instructions. Then when TAing with him I saw how students could creatively misinterpret instructions, even when I could not imagine how to make them more precise. An exception for the new case would be added to the next iteration of the assignments. I only understoo…

So, I don't know where I read this (might have been here on HN) something like: If you create the rules for the pathological cases, then you're "optimizing" for those. Not for the majority. Whereas the pathological cases should be dealt exactly like those. Though sure, sometimes explanations can be better, but you can only play the game up to a point

On the other hand, if you don't address the pathological cases in writing, 90% of your time will be taken up by the 10% of people who rules-lawyer their way through life: Pointing out the lack of written clarity, complaining about 'hidden rules', writing a letter to object, appealing to your boss, appealing to boss's boss, lodging a formal complaint with leadership implying discrimination, getting actual lawyers involved, and on and on and on.

There are a small number of people who just live for the thrill of taking advantage of poorly documented rules or process. They act disingenuously under the guise of sincerity. "I'm just trying to clarify: Nowhere is it written that [$obvious_bad_behavior] is not allowed, therefore how am I supposed to know??" People who spend more time scrutinizing their university's Policies, Rules and Regulations, and Code Of Conduct, looking for exploitable flaws, than they would ever spend actually reading their assignments. Happens in the business world too. I've seen salesmen who couldn't multiply two three-digit numbers together turn into Albert Einstein when the year's bonus structure got published.

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