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Facebook loses users for the first time

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#211

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

kumarvvr wrote: post #140
josefrichter wrote: post #131

My 16yo daughter says FB is for old people and nobody in her age group is using it.

I guess the business model of social media companies is coming to fore. FB has a captive audience, that is aging with facebook and will continue using it. It is clear why FB purchases IG / WA. They are paying money to capture audiences with money earned from FB. Going ahead, the cycle will repeat. Once the teens in IG grow into adults, FB will use money from that to buy / make another platform. In this context, the m…

Except there are 2 major differences:

1. Even if FB isn't forced to divest their recent acquisitions, the regulatory environment will make it much more difficult to do the equivalent of buying Instagram in the future.

2. Any good ideas on how I can short "The Metaverse"? I still think the Metaverse is bullshit and will continue to be bullshit for the near future. The very first time I got on Facebook I was pretty enthralled - I was connecting with friends that I hadn't seen in years, and I really liked reconnecting. I have heard basically nobody say they are looking forward to the Metaverse, besides aging tech giants trying to push it.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#212

Post by totony »

egfx wrote: post #127
rudyfink wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it feels like a return to the walled-garden days of America Online, Prodigy, CompuServe, etc. Essentially, they seem to be want to create a separate network that they control--one that is not "internet-ed" to other networks in an open fashion.

Yep I guess the pull to be a walled garden is too great. Even Twitter, a product that should have been the true antithesis to walled garden pigeon holed themselves into walled garden state. I wrote a blog post about it a long time ago https://medium.com/@shareU/we-built-this-city-2cb97437942f

>walled garden

>links medium blog post which can only be accessed behind a login

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#213

Post by version_five »

xyzzy123 wrote: post #153
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

reddit used to be great until they pulled their great bait & switch, then added all kinds of authoritarian features. A brief history of reddit: > We want to democratize the traditional model by giving editorial control to the people who use the site, not those who run it. — Reddit FAQ 2005 > We've always benefited from a policy of not censoring content — u/kn0thing 2008 > A bastion of free speech on the World Wide We…

It feels like reddit changed in line with the rest of the Internet though. In 2022 you have the choice of a) "suppressing free speech" or b) "platforming racists" and there is no middle ground and no way to win. You can't pass the buck to moderators. The choice did not feel so stark in 2005.

Just because you think the choice needs to be framed that way doesn't make it true. This reminds me of the political mailers that the Canadian conservatives used to send out: it was something like "do you support our reform of law X or do you support keeping child molesters on the street". Its a pretty low form of rhetoric.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#214

Post by triactual »

xyzzy123 wrote: post #153
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

reddit used to be great until they pulled their great bait & switch, then added all kinds of authoritarian features. A brief history of reddit: > We want to democratize the traditional model by giving editorial control to the people who use the site, not those who run it. — Reddit FAQ 2005 > We've always benefited from a policy of not censoring content — u/kn0thing 2008 > A bastion of free speech on the World Wide We…

It feels like reddit changed in line with the rest of the Internet though. In 2022 you have the choice of a) "suppressing free speech" or b) "platforming racists" and there is no middle ground and no way to win. You can't pass the buck to moderators. The choice did not feel so stark in 2005.

There never has been middle ground. Why do you think the ACLU defended KKK members.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#215

Post by totony »

notyourwork wrote: post #210
ahmed_ds wrote: post #121

The fact of the matter is they still have close 2 billion active logins each day. Even if they have settled in matters of user acquisitions they haven't stopped harvesting increasing amounts of profit from each users. I would like to know how the statistics of revenue per user would be from this point on.

I'd like clear qualifying of what a login means. Does that mean I goto facebook.com or open FB app at least once a day? I imagine "daily login" could be artificially inflated in all sorts of ways like having fb.com tab open on my browser and never actually going to it as one example.

Yeah, I "log in" a few times a day to answer messages. I don't think that should be considered a user since I'm not consuming anything facebook-related, just responding to messages because everyone is on facebook

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#216

Post by Calist0 »

mmaunder wrote: post #194

And thus begins their gamble. They’re going to have to bet the entire biz on virtual. Most public companies can’t do this, but FB has a unique control structure that gives Zuck the ability to bet the farm.

They have to invest in something if they want to remain relevant. They make loads of money from their ad revenue. They may not be able to acquire the next Instagram or TikTok when it comes.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#217

Post by jonhohle »

xyzzy123 wrote: post #153
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

reddit used to be great until they pulled their great bait & switch, then added all kinds of authoritarian features. A brief history of reddit: > We want to democratize the traditional model by giving editorial control to the people who use the site, not those who run it. — Reddit FAQ 2005 > We've always benefited from a policy of not censoring content — u/kn0thing 2008 > A bastion of free speech on the World Wide We…

It feels like reddit changed in line with the rest of the Internet though. In 2022 you have the choice of a) "suppressing free speech" or b) "platforming racists" and there is no middle ground and no way to win. You can't pass the buck to moderators. The choice did not feel so stark in 2005.

And? Are racists really worse than other types of bigots (misogynists, intellectuals, anti-intellectuals, eugenicists, radical anarchists, religious zealots, anti-religious zealots, republicans, democrats, etc.)?

There are definitely approved forms of bigotry that are tolerated on just about every social media platform. I’ve never seen a post promoting death to unvaccinated moderated, for example. I really hate the idea that because a site has racist users that it would be considered a racist platform. That’s throwing the baby out with the bath water.

On sites like reddit, I can ignore hateful subreddits just as easily as other topics I’m not interested in. I don’t think it’s reasonable that there is an expectation that every platform police everything that might offend someone and I don’t know of any platform that attempts to. Certain bigotry is just less tolerated by admins than others.

r/conspiracy is an interesting example. Opposing views on just about any topic are accepted and there’s genuinely a lot of critical thinking and research that goes into many of the comments. Sure it’s filled with crap posts, loonies, and paranoids, but constructive, respectful discussion is had about topics considered too taboo for most other subreddits. And they are maligned by most of Reddit to the point where certain subs will ban you just for subscribing or posting to it.

Disclaimer: of course racism is awful and stupid. I’m not advocating promoting racists or misogynists or any other hate group. I just think the benefits of open, free discussion out way the drawbacks of hateful, stupid discussion.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#218

Post by kerneloftruth »

xyzzy123 wrote: post #153
NaturalPhallacy wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

reddit used to be great until they pulled their great bait & switch, then added all kinds of authoritarian features. A brief history of reddit: > We want to democratize the traditional model by giving editorial control to the people who use the site, not those who run it. — Reddit FAQ 2005 > We've always benefited from a policy of not censoring content — u/kn0thing 2008 > A bastion of free speech on the World Wide We…

It feels like reddit changed in line with the rest of the Internet though. In 2022 you have the choice of a) "suppressing free speech" or b) "platforming racists" and there is no middle ground and no way to win. You can't pass the buck to moderators. The choice did not feel so stark in 2005.

   In 2022 you have the choice of a) "suppressing free speech" or b) "platforming racists"
There's a great example of the False Choice fallacy. "Free Speech" = "Racism" is the implication of your choice -- one which authoritarians would indeed embrace. The Soviets considered free speech dangerous, too; and so does the CCP.

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#219

Post by synthos »

rubicon33 wrote: post #155
stadium wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They finally monitized their products and customers to a breaking point. They run on engagement metrics without common sense or empathy to how fear and anger impact their user's wellbeing. I most definitely do not need or want a VR immersed version of that toxicity.

VR has nothing to do with facebook, at least at the moment. Just logging in with your facebook account doesn't mean its suddenly sucking all your life from you and piping it right to facebook. If you enjoy video games, its hands down the best way to game right now.

Is it? Last I understood, most games have no real locomotion to prevent motion sickness. Is it really the pinnacle of gaming if you have to teleport from A->B all the time?

Re: Facebook loses users for the first time

#220

Post by Calist0 »

manquer wrote: post #174
ahmed_ds wrote: post #121

The fact of the matter is they still have close 2 billion active logins each day. Even if they have settled in matters of user acquisitions they haven't stopped harvesting increasing amounts of profit from each users. I would like to know how the statistics of revenue per user would be from this point on.

The revenue guidance for next quarter is not very great either, so given the user numbers ARPU is not growing

They're still growing year-over-year. They were just off their target in the last quarter by 3%. They're valued at $3.67 per share versus the $3.78 expected. Their stock literally dropped ~25% because they were only 3% off expected earnings. And lost 0.15% active users, which is expected as the world opens up again. I don't see what the big deal is. The market is overreacting.
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