Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#211

Post by leokennis » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 9:56 AM UTC

forgotpwd16 wrote: post #150

vxNsr wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook’s culture is “move fast and break things” the exact opposite of what you want from a utility used by billions every minute. Forgetting Facebook and insta for a second, WhatsApp really is the defacto phone and text service for many parts of the world: the taliban set up WhatsApp groups to manage things as they took over in Kabul. Putting a little more maturity into their SOP isn’t the worst thing.

>move fast and break things How often Facebook really breaks? I've had a much higher number of electricity blackouts and internet outages in the last decade than Facebook going down. Basically I don't even recall Facebook ever going down for that long, or breaking in any other way.

Regardless; imagine your bank or the company that builds a bridge having "move fast and break things" engrained into their corporate culture?

If you want to be taken serious as a messenger app, you need to align your corporate culture and processes to reflect that.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#212

Post by leokennis » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 9:58 AM UTC

darth_avocado wrote: post #24

I know it’s hard for a lot of people but why do we automatically blame everything on Facebook? The inaccessibility to WhatsApp completely brings life to a standstill for a lot of people across the world. Isn’t that more of a failure on the part of the governments, people and companies that exist there? How is a app that needs access to internet somehow a bigger necessity than the basic function of the device the app…

Yes, there is a lot of blame on governments for relying on WA.

But let's be real here, Facebook is also marketing WA as a better alternative to sms, mail etc.

So if Facebook wants to position WA as critical communications infrastructure, they should maintain it as such.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#213

Post by MaKey » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:01 AM UTC

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #36

I ditched WhatsApp when I switched from Android to iOS and WhatsApp would not import my history. I lost years of texting and image history, and just decided there was no reason to use WhatsApp if they can’t keep my history (possibly the most important part of texting including the images!)

This feature is coming: https://www.theverge.com/2021/8/11/22619664/whatsapp-android...

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#214

Post by eyko » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:04 AM UTC

GeckoEidechse wrote: post #180

pjc50 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure, telcos sucked, but there were tons of them spread across all corners of the globe Local monopolies rather than a global one. What if there was a global, international messaging system available to everyone with a phone, that strove for five-nines reliability? And wasn't funded by advertising? And didn't deplatform anyone(+)? Oh wait it's called SMS and everyone hates it, largely for good reasons. The internet…

I mean a reason SMS gets its hate is because the moment you send a message across international borders you start paying ridiculously large sums of money (compared to the amount of data transferred) for every single message. If you now take Europe for example where it's easy to have friends in another country that you talk to regularly and you can see why WhatsApp quickly gained in popularity there simply because it…

The EU capped intra-EU calls and SMS prices a few years ago: https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/intra-eu-c...

Perhaps too little too late since everyone now uses messaging apps for practically no cost.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#215

Post by herbst » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:05 AM UTC

GeckoEidechse wrote: post #180

pjc50 wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sure, telcos sucked, but there were tons of them spread across all corners of the globe Local monopolies rather than a global one. What if there was a global, international messaging system available to everyone with a phone, that strove for five-nines reliability? And wasn't funded by advertising? And didn't deplatform anyone(+)? Oh wait it's called SMS and everyone hates it, largely for good reasons. The internet…

I mean a reason SMS gets its hate is because the moment you send a message across international borders you start paying ridiculously large sums of money (compared to the amount of data transferred) for every single message. If you now take Europe for example where it's easy to have friends in another country that you talk to regularly and you can see why WhatsApp quickly gained in popularity there simply because it…

Within Europe monthly free SMS to other European countries have been a common theme for a while. The main reason I see nether SMS not WhatsApp being popular today around here is how much more a app like Telegram does and how some of these apps actually protect your privacy. SMS is flawed, and WhatsApp everything but private.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#216

Post by drdeadringer » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:05 AM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #75

Was talking about this with a friend today, and I think this incident highlights why I sometimes get really depressed about my career and technology. I'm a Gen X-er, and I started my career in the late 90s. Before that I was a ham radio operator in junior high and HS (back when they had Morse code tests!). I remember the heady euphoria around the Internet then, and the vision of "tech utopia" was certainly the domina…

> in junior high and HS (back when they had Morse code tests!)

I was in the same framing of age and schooling as you describe, and in an affluent area as well; perhaps the difference between your technology classes and mine was that mine were not "ham radio oriented".

Not that I'm disinterested.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#217

Post by MaKey » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

darth_avocado wrote: post #24

I know it’s hard for a lot of people but why do we automatically blame everything on Facebook? The inaccessibility to WhatsApp completely brings life to a standstill for a lot of people across the world. Isn’t that more of a failure on the part of the governments, people and companies that exist there? How is a app that needs access to internet somehow a bigger necessity than the basic function of the device the app…

Calls can be listened to and texts can be read by Governments. In my opinion that's unlikely to change so there will always be a good reason to use apps like WhatsApp or Signal for communication.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#218

Post by intricatedetail » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #75

Was talking about this with a friend today, and I think this incident highlights why I sometimes get really depressed about my career and technology. I'm a Gen X-er, and I started my career in the late 90s. Before that I was a ham radio operator in junior high and HS (back when they had Morse code tests!). I remember the heady euphoria around the Internet then, and the vision of "tech utopia" was certainly the domina…

The problem is that these corporations don't pay correct taxes and corrupt agencies don't do anything about it. This is causing centralisation as they have huge competitive advantage over honest businesses.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#219

Post by herbst » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:10 AM UTC

jkelleyrtp wrote: post #94

Why would breaking Facebook down and regulating them solve anything related to the global dependence on WhatsApp? Aren’t the only people who know how to run these services already running them? Like, do we expect the government to take WhatsApp away from Facebook and then create government contracts for companies like Oracle to maintain the infrastructure? So we’re back to square one but with the bureaucratic mess of…

This would only make it worse. The reason barely anyone in my environment uses WhatsApp is because they don't trust them. I doubt they would trust the US gov more than Facebook, these days.

Re: Facebook going down meant more than just a social network being unavailable

#220

Post by merrywhether » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 10:12 AM UTC

leokennis wrote: post #212

darth_avocado wrote: post #24

I know it’s hard for a lot of people but why do we automatically blame everything on Facebook? The inaccessibility to WhatsApp completely brings life to a standstill for a lot of people across the world. Isn’t that more of a failure on the part of the governments, people and companies that exist there? How is a app that needs access to internet somehow a bigger necessity than the basic function of the device the app…

Yes, there is a lot of blame on governments for relying on WA. But let's be real here, Facebook is also marketing WA as a better alternative to sms, mail etc. So if Facebook wants to position WA as critical communications infrastructure, they should maintain it as such.

WA _is_ a better alternative to SMS and mail. Outs not the only one perhaps, but that doesn’t make that statement less true.