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Why Doesn't Software Show Up in Productivity?

austinvernon.eth.link

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Re: Why Doesn't Software Show Up in Productivity?

#211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say anything about consumers caring whether a program was written in C++ or Rust, and I don't think consumers care about that. I talked about whether the product is full of memory unsafety or not. Where that is a relevant aspect of your product, Rust is far, far more productive--it's more or less impossible to produce a large C++ program without exploitable memory unsafety bugs, while it's fairly tractable i…

There is indeed a flat productivity metric. But of course, a programming language being a tool, its impact on productivity varies from product to product. I think my previous comment stands: Do you need fewer people to develop and maintain the product? That applies to every situation.

It entirely depends on what you mean by "the product" and I can't help but feel that you are deliberately missing my point. Suppose we take it as a given that for any given program, ignoring performance, a pure Python program requires fewer developers to implement the same number of features than the same program in C++; does it then follow that we would need fewer Python developers to build a web browser than C++ developers? It does not, because you simply could not build a web browser in pure Python that would fulfill people's performance expectations. But for many other projects, the claim does follow, because they are within the realm of "stuff you can do in pure Python."

My claim is that a similar phenomenon applies for C++ and security, regardless of whether Rust is otherwise more productive: no matter how many people you add to a large C++ project, you are not going to come close to the level of assurance on security properties that you get from a Rust program of the same size (your only real hope is formal verification, which for verifying code in just about any language is multiple times less productive than writing the same code without verification). For these cases, asking which is more productive is pointless--C++ cannot deliver the expected product. However, if this is not the case for your project, I believe Rust's productivity benefits are more modest and are probably outweighed by things like team experience and available tooling.

I think I'm being pretty clear here about what I mean and why your question does have a single answer that applies in all situations.

Re: Why Doesn't Software Show Up in Productivity?

#212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coding is hard though. I remember helping a smart friend of mine with his homework in college for an intro CS course and even basic fizz-buzz type stuff was very hard for him. This is a guy who has had a highly successful career post-college and did well in his (non-technical) major. I'm skeptical that more than a small fraction of the population will ever learn to code at more than a superficial level.

"They said you couldn't teach women to read" - Santa Claus' Grandfather in Arthur Christmas (Best Xmas kids film, not best source of political quotes but I am still asleep)

I don't think anyone has seriously said that for a long, long time, if ever. Literacy is obviously pretty easy, much easier than algebra, for example, because in societies with universal schooling almost everyone learns how to do it.
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