211–220 of 860 posts
> Apple was surprised its stance then was not more popular, and the global tide since then has been toward more monitoring of private communication Huh. That’s a big problem. If the American public doesn’t support privacy, we won’t have it.
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They're searching for different things though. To my knowledge, before now iOS has never scanned for fingerprints of specific photographs. It would be so darn easy to replace the CSAM database with fingerprints of known tiananmen square photos...
So you have User A - they upload a pic with User A and Peoples B,C,D,E,Z icloud scans for those faces finds those faces and ties them to other ID accounts via face - then via fingerprint recognition to a device, and to a location based on IMEI etc. Apple's platform is literally the foundation for the most dystopian digital tool-set in history... Once the government is able to crack the apple war chest, everything is…
Go fuck yourself.
> It's a complete change of narrative and there's no easy way to explain it and still defend Apple's Privacy narrative, wihout doing extreme mental gymnastics. Everyone who took Apple at their word was already doing extreme mental gymnastics because Apple's privacy stance was a farce on borrowed time to begin with. Now it's just blatantly obvious to everyone.
Please stop insulting people because they chose less privacy than you. Don't act superior. I would posit that just about everyone who reads hackernews knows that privacy and security are on a spectrum. People complaining about this as the last straw have every right to do so and this is a huge leap from Apple's previous position. No one thinks you're any smarter by saying "I told you so".
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Apple already scans your photos for faces and syncs found faces through iCloud. I’d imagine updating that machine learning model is at least as straightforward as this one.
A false positive in matching faces results in a click to fix it or a wrongly categorized photo. A false positive in this new thing may land you in jail or have your life destroyed. Even an allegation of something so heinous is enough to ruin a life. The "one in trillion" chance of false positives is Apple's invention. They haven't scanned trillions of photos and it's a guess. And you need multiple false positives, ye…
So iCloud Photos circa 2020 [and Google Photos and Facebook and Dropbox and OneDrive] aren’t a risk you should be willing to take.
This feature doesn’t change anything in that regard; the scanning was already happening.
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>the system is just a few bit flips away from scanning every photo on your device I prefer to think of it as being just one national security letter away from that happening. Which is of course a schroedinger's cat kinda thing. It's already been sent. Or it hasn't. But why would the national security apparatus not take advantage of this obvious opportunity? Anyone giving benefit of the doubt to this kind of stuff now…
How would the agency issuing an NSL be able to generate a hash of a photo they’re looking for? Presumably if they already had a photo to derive the hash they’d already have whatever it is they’re searching for.
For a normal law enforcement context, say you bust 1 drug dealer, and are trying to find more. Maybe they have an image of a "contract" (document outlining terms of a drug deal) on their phone. You could find the other parties to that contract by searching everyone's phones for that image.
For a national security context, you could imagine equivalents to the above, you could also imagine searching for classified documents that are believed to have been leaked, or maybe searching for documents you stole from an adversary that you believe there spies are likely to be storing on their phones.
I'm saying documents here instead of images, but plenty of documents are just images, and I have little doubt that they could get this program to expand to include "scan PDFs, because you could make a CSAM into a pdf" (if it doesn't already?).
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Simple - our laws haven't evolved with technology. That's why your mail has about a million times more protection than your email.
Yup. That's what happens when the country is ran by a bunch of old lawyers.
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It’s silly to think the US government hasn’t been twisting their arm to do this for years.
My ears perk up whenever I hear a "Just think of the Children" argument because after Sandy Hook, I'm pretty certain the US could careless about children. There's a real reason behind this.
I just do not want Apple scanning my phone for the purpose of finding something they can send to the police. I’m not even talking about any “slippery slope” scenarios and I’ll never have any of the material they are looking for. And right or wrong, I don’t really fear a false identification, so this isn’t about a worry that they will actually turn me in. I just don’t want them scanning my phone for the purpose of tur…
How difficult would it be to transform it into looking for images from political dissenters? Now, you have a magical list to find targets to probe further.
Maybe you want to identify behaviors you disagree with.
Images tell a story and maybe not to the people who are looking out for your best interests.
Wrong think always changes.
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The practical difference is that with on-device scanning, the system is just a few bit flips away from scanning every photo on your device, instead of just the ones that are about to be uploaded. With server-side scanning, the separation is clear—what's on Apple's server can be scanned, and what's only on your phone cannot. This all plays so perfectly into my long-time fears about the locked down nature of the iPhone…
How is it any more ‘bit flips’ away from scanning every photo on your device than it was before?
if (willBeUploaded) {
scanPhoto();
}
if (true) {
scanPhoto();
}
"Apple says it will scan only in the United States and other countries to be added one by one, only when images are set to be uploaded to iCloud, and only for images that have been identified by the National Center for Exploited and Missing Children and a small number of other groups." First reference I read about adding other countries as a done deal, and especially about an incredibly opaque "small number of other…