Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever • Hacker News Board

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#211

Post by Haemm0r » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:28 PM UTC

Nursie wrote: post #123

qw wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's mostly about the emotional attachment. If you find two identical pens, and one of them was used by a famous writer, you would expect a price difference. There is no difference in the quality of those pens. They both work the same, and using the writer's pen will not make you a better writer by itself. I personally would not buy a natural diamond because of the ethical issues, but I do understand the students who…

That's a good point, the difference doesn't have to be in the item itself, BUT - Does anyone, other than geologists of course, really care about the back-story of the diamond, how it was created and how it was mined? Or are they just hanging on to an idea that some of them are "real" and some "not real" for the purposes of social signalling? If the latter, I would consider this much more changeable over time.

"Does anyone, other than geologists of course, really care about the back-story of the diamond, how it was created and how it was mined?" Yes of course. Everybody can buy a ring with a diamond, but if they sell you a story with it you can tell, it is even better :)

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#212

Post by NikolaNovak » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:28 PM UTC

bildung wrote: post #179

NikolaNovak wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My initial instinct agreed with you,but I then wondered if there would actually be a relevant gender difference in answers. In western culture, still today I think,majority of men would be buying and majority of women would be receiving diamonds. It would be interesting if this affects answers. Would a buyer go for more practical cheaper option while receiver goes for more expensive traditional options? Or a differen…

> In western culture This phenomenon has to be more localized than Western culture (the worldwide diamond consumption hints at it being US-specific?) - I for example don't know anyone who even contemplated buying one for proposing. Granted, this is purely anectotal, but over extended family and workplace colleagues this includes a bunch of milieus.

Sure; there's definitely going to be a significant time variable then if we want to start getting specific.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#213

Post by myfavoritedog » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:29 PM UTC

ivanhoe wrote: post #106

simonh wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the best option available to people was diamond mining, by taking that away from them we’re by definition pushing them into an even worse option. That’s a big problem I have with a lot of the do-good commentary on developing world labour. Taking away options from people, even bad ones from our point of view, isn’t necessarily doing them any favours. None of these peoples options are going to look good to us. Actua…

So far these diamonds were both the primary cause of conflicts, as well as the main way of financing and prolonging them. Wars are expensive, so if you take money out of the game many militias/ fractions/ criminals will simply loose interest in those territories, and that should reduce the corruption and make things more stable for people there. In theory, that's way more important for progress than outside help, alt…

If it isn't diamonds, it will be land, water rights, drug distribution, religious purity, and on and on.

Diamonds are just another means of gaining power and wealth. They're only a problem in societies that don't have the mechanisms for dealing with inevitable power and wealth disparities.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#214

Post by gspr » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:29 PM UTC

The_rationalist wrote: post #75

Off-topic: Nylene blue made a video where he transform (serendipitously) glass beads to very beautiful "jowels" through supracritical impacts. I wonder if this paradigm has been tried for jewels and if it could make more interesting lab grown diamonds. https://youtu.be/JslxPjrMzqY

Not to nitpick, but just to make sure this wonderful creator gets credit where credit's due: his youtuber name is NileRed, and NileBlue (not Nylene blue) is the name of his secondary, less serious and less scripted, channel.

https://www.youtube.com/user/TheRedNile

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#215

Post by offtop5 » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:30 PM UTC

vagrantJin wrote: post #197

qw wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's mostly about the emotional attachment. If you find two identical pens, and one of them was used by a famous writer, you would expect a price difference. There is no difference in the quality of those pens. They both work the same, and using the writer's pen will not make you a better writer by itself. I personally would not buy a natural diamond because of the ethical issues, but I do understand the students who…

"Okay class, child labour, a few thousand poor people dead, terrorist groups starving hundreds of thousands, destroying schools and libraries. That is where diamonds come from. How many would still want a natural diamond because diamonds are forever?" The elephant in that lecture hall was probably the hypocrisy. I think if you still raise a hand after hearing all that, the issue isn't branding at all. It's narcissim,…

It also factors into how someone grew up.

I'd rather toss 10k into a couple emergency fund then waste it on a ring. Most marriages collapse due to money. I recall in my younger days I was with a girl and she dragged me to Brooks Brothers. As a child of poverty and evictions I couldn't understand why anyone who need to spend this much money on a shirt.

Even making well into the 6 figures I shop at Old Navy. Hell, my favorite partner thus far was making 200k or so, and she still used an IPhone 6.

Maybe whenever I meet someone new I'll ask on the first date, would you rather have 10k saved in an emergency fund or a shinny conflict rock ? Her response will tell me everything I need to know.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#216

Post by Angostura » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:30 PM UTC

joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

NFTs suggest that there will never be an end to the appetite for making things 'special'.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#217

Post by slightwinder » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:30 PM UTC

dijit wrote: post #83

simonh wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the best option available to people was diamond mining, by taking that away from them we’re by definition pushing them into an even worse option. That’s a big problem I have with a lot of the do-good commentary on developing world labour. Taking away options from people, even bad ones from our point of view, isn’t necessarily doing them any favours. None of these peoples options are going to look good to us. Actua…

> If the best option available to people was diamond mining, by taking that away from them we’re by definition pushing them into an even worse option. If your business is to force people into slavery, then it is part of your business to remove other avenues for them to get out of slavery.

But then the best option would be to fix the business, not take it away and put more pressure on people, forcing them into another slavery.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#218

Post by Sakos » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:30 PM UTC

tom_mellior wrote: post #139

joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

> our teacher asked all of the women Sounds like a pretty sexist thing to do. The same question can be asked without putting women on the spot. "If you were to buy a diamond, what would you rather choose?"

He asked that way because it's irrelevant what the man would choose in the case that he's buying it for a woman (which is generally the case). If a majority of women prefer "real" diamonds, there's no way he's going to use his preference over hers for something this important. Women's preferences determine diamond buying behavior on the market. If you want to make a difference, you have to start there.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#219

Post by raverbashing » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:31 PM UTC

slightwinder wrote: post #209

raverbashing wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He should have explained about DeBeers. That would have brought the number of raised hands down. The ice analogy is a bit faulty because no one is eating their diamonds and the impurities are technically advantageous (though most people want the shiny "perfect" diamond which are much easier to come about artificially).

Aren't the impurities which make them shiny? Or is this also just marketing?

No, impurities would make it not white. Pure diamonds are shiny the same way (shinier than glass).

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#220

Post by chrisseaton » Tue, May 04, 2021, 12:32 PM UTC

gspr wrote: post #206

croo wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not op, but yes. Engagement traditionally is giving a ring to your desired future wife. I don't understand your point. Of course you can ignore tradition but then why marry in the first place?

> Of course you can ignore tradition but then why marry in the first place? I find it strange how many people seem to be able to separate a tradition from physical items traditionally involved in that tradition.

> I find it strange how many people seem to be able to separate a tradition from physical items traditionally involved in that tradition.

They're just symbols - I don't think it's strange that many people are able to separate them.